My Philosophy on getting stuck

[gv280z]

Ever since I was a young guy, I don't know, somewhere in my teens or earlier maybe, I always wanted a 4x4. The Toyota in Back to the Future probably had a lot to do with it. Anyway, now that I've got one of course I want to play in the mud with it, and also wanted to be able to be useful in emergency offroad situations. As we all know this requires traction and clearance, & power and ofcourse what a rabbit hole that is to fall into.

 

After watching offroading videos on Youtube for hours, and this one inparticular (not offroading vid but this guy is stuck in the mud, literally) http://safeshare.tv/w/kRRyGqbZGQ I eventually came to a realization about mudding and your vehicle and You: ANYTHING CAN GET STUCK. Boom, there it is. Seeing a 10" lifted monster redneck truck with 37" boggers get stuck (just a generic generalization from watching youtube vids) and the aforementioned guy stuck up to his knees in mud puts it all into perspective for me atleast.

 

We put so much emphasis on tires and traction, but the reality is that even if you've got a set of TSL Super Swampers on your ride and you wander off into something deeper than 2/3rds the height of the tire (thick mud) with a stock ride height now you've involved the axles and the undercarriage, the chassis, and you gonna get stuck. With a lift ofcourse this is staved off a bit but the A-Arms and rear axle are still being dragged through the mud.

 

So far I'm happy with my new Coopers, and only a small part of me..maybe 20% I feel like I want to upgrade to an M/T, put a bit of a lift, AND THAT'S IT! Psychologically I am set against allowing myself to fall down that rabbit hole when I KNOW bigger, meaner and WAAAAY more expensive trucks than mine get stuck in mud that they shouldn't have wondered into, Ofcourse this is akin to comparing a toddlers stride to an adult stride, but I guess (maybe it's just me) it's always kinda seemed like there was a point of demarcation that if you have Y=Tire size times Z=lift / truck size divided by HP, then X = NEVER GETTING STUCK....it's not true.

 

For me, I'm not going to waste the time, effort or money. I love the classic look of my WD21 and don't want to mess it up. I know that stock this truck was one tough SOB and that I feel lucky to own one in good condition I haven't had to put that much in repairs to. I know this is a hard core offroading website where I guess it kind of IS the point to go overboard and enjoy setting your imagination on cruise control and BELIEVE me I get that 100% I don't mean to step on anyones toes, and some of you guys here have done some incredible things with your trucks. Personally for my life I can't allow myself to get caught up in some of that stuff.

 

 

I do LOVE to tinker with stuff and invest lots of time and effort on trying to improve, re-invent, re-imagine and put my own personal spin on something. I used to be really into R/C cars and rock crawlers and playing with store bought toys and putting way too fast motors and hobby grade electronics and stuff into them somehow, even though they weren't designed for it. I get it. Maybe I'm getting older, maybe my wife has corrupted (straightened out) my imagination and drive to waste lots of time and money on fun but pointless projects, who knows.

 

When I began to plan this post, I didn't know it was going to turn into this, didn't really mean for it to go on like this. Just meant to express a feeling and this all poured out, I guess after seeing that guy that got stuck while WALKING in the mud it made me think, if this guy can get stuck like that, anything can.

 

Gotta get back to work! Almost time to go home too...gotta get some work done.

 

Greg

[AndyC]

Sounds like way more than 20% of you is unsure! First time I've read someone publicly talking themselves out of modifying their truck!

[5523Pathfinder]

Wheeling, in general, is a lot more than plowing through mud. Gys usually build their rigs for their local terrain. Your right, big tires and big lift don't mean much of anything, well, unless your compensating for something. If you pay attention to the big, well know off road builders, they have changed from tall, stiff suspensions, to low slung, soft suspensions with lots of travel. Heck, even king of the hammers had rigs going to full independent suspensions! This hobby is changing everyday, but maybe that's why some of like it so much. Personally, I like having a bit bigger tire(33's, woohoo!). The pathfinder in general looks a lot better with a bigger tire.

 

Some say "If your not breaking stuff or getting stuck, your not trying hard enough!". While i agree pushing your limits is a good thing to do, I don't think it necessary you need to break stuff every time you wheel. It's is what a good dual purpous rig is about. Works great off road, but can still take you to work everyday.

[bushnut]

generally the point of off roading is getting stuck, half the fun is getting unstuck. Its a hillbilly way of male bonding and team building. Just like when I was a kid my brother and I would go out in the canoe and "practice" flipping it and getting back in. Mostly its a game of "Lets see if I can get through that"!

Also modifying your vehicle is just a way of learning about it and making it yours.

[Precise1]

Hey Greg!!

Yeah, everything you have said is absolutely true, anything can get stuck if you try, although some put up a damn good fight! The reality comes in 3 levels AFAIC.

That are you trying to do/where are you trying to go?

Does it need to be street legal?

How much do you want to spend?

 

My version of wheeling is more expedition style where you get no points for breaking things or getting stuck, there might not be anyone to get you out! I pick my line carefully and look for the easy way...

Nothing against the mud boggers or rock crawlers, they are just different sports AFAIC.

For me, I'm not going to waste the time, effort or money. I love the classic look of my WD21 and don't want to mess it up. I know that stock this truck was one tough SOB and that I feel lucky to own one in good condition I haven't had to put that much in repairs to. I know this is a hard core offroading website where I guess it kind of IS the point to go overboard and enjoy setting your imagination on cruise control and BELIEVE me I get that 100% I don't mean to step on anyones toes, and some of you guys here have done some incredible things with your trucks. Personally for my life I can't allow myself to get caught up in some of that stuff.

Fair enough Bud, it's your truck and you know what you want it for. I will play devils advocate though...

Rims and tires: Wider rims for a more stable stance and some aggressive AT or even mild MT tires will make the biggest difference there is. The wider rims help keep the body off of obstacles...

Mild suspension lift: Rear coils and cranking the T-bars/alignment. 2" benefit for less than $200

Swap in an LSD rear if you do not have it already

Good recovery points, meaning dual hooks up front and a good point in the rear...

 

You don't have to dive into every mudhole you see, but a little bit upgrade will make the pathy far more capable!

Here is my example. Ignore the bumper and it has a 2" body lift as well as a suspension lift so -2" at the wheel wells, otherwise those are 15x8" rims with 31" tires on it. Not remotely overdone and perfectly drivable every day, yet quite capable offroad.

Did I lose any classic lines?

 

 

B

[Nefarious]

nice truck ^ . i love it!

[gv280z]

Precise 1 your truck is just about perfect, that is roughly my goal, if I could gradually spend the doh and get away with it without setting off the wife alarm, which is like moving at the pace of about a centimeter a month...I've already got my 31" tires, now I just want some cooler looking rims and do a spacer insert for the rear springs and crank the t bars in the front and then try to get it aligned, hopefully the alignment guys aren't like 'Well, uhh your cranked up too high in the front, we gonna HAVE to bring that down man!'

 

Maybe in a couple of years I might be able to step to a 32" or 33" but the bigger heavier tires with the larger diameter raises the over all gear ratio which lowers torque and adds strain to the engine and drive train so I might just stop with the 32" x 11.50

 

But yes, you and I seem to fall inline as far as these things go, your truck looks great. Very smart.

Edited June 7, 2013 by gv280z

[devonianwalk]

 

 

nice truck ^ . i love it!

 

 

Precise 1 your truck is just about perfect, that is roughly my goal, ...

 

Yes. I totally agree. Even though that older WD21 Pathy is in the way, it is one nice looking rig. Don't you have a better shot of her?

[nismothunder]

Well since you asked for it, DVW

 

Boom, here it is.

 

 

[Braden620]

I would think that if you could avoid a large mud hole, go around, and still get to where you need to go, you should. I always avoid mud and water when Im in a truck, on a dirtbike, or anything.

[devonianwalk]

I would think that if you could avoid a large mud hole, go around, and still get to where you need to go, you should. I always avoid mud and water when Im in a truck, on a dirtbike, or anything.

 

Yes. If I can avoid it, I do (now). I learned my lesson the hard way.

[adamzan]

I have honestly never broken anything while offroad. The only thing I did do was not pay attention while driving through some tall grass and smash my bumper and fender in... I got stuck more once my truck was lifted and had better tires because I got cocky and thought it could go anywhere.

 

To be totally honest, I had the most fun with my pathy when it was stock

[devonianwalk]

When mine was stock I solely used it for trips and tailgating at college football games. In fact, I wanted a SUV so that I could tailgate (we have season tix).

[Precise1]

nice truck ^ . i love it!

Precise 1 your truck is just about perfect, that is roughly my goal, if I could gradually spend the doh and get away with it without setting off the wife alarm, which is like moving at the pace of about a centimeter a month...

But yes, you and I seem to fall inline as far as these things go, your truck looks great. Very smart.

Thanks guys! The wife doesn't really mind me upgrading my Pathy, because in reality I am into it for about $7k and it has 106k miles on it. It will last me a long time, will be exactly the way I want it and is still several times cheaper than a new truck.

 

Yes. I totally agree. Even though that older WD21 Pathy is in the way, it is one nice looking rig. Don't you have a better shot of her?

Good one!

Funny thing is the WD21 has 106k miles and the R50 has 172k. The 'older' is actually newer...

 

I would think that if you could avoid a large mud hole, go around, and still get to where you need to go, you should. I always avoid mud and water when Im in a truck, on a dirtbike, or anything.

I agree if I am treking, but it is fun to play sometimes also.

 

B

[92Path_68CJ]

I did almost all the black diamond trails in Big Bear stock.
I couldn't do John Bull, and three or four more that come to mind.

 

You get stuck when you do not know your vehicle well, your modifications aren't "in sync", and you don't have a grasp of where to put the tires or cannot IMO.

 

I wheel stock rigs into and out of areas where people have come in after me and broken axles....

[ahardb0dy]

Any truck can get stuck it just depends on what the truck is built for. You could run small tires and make it through any mud hole if you had about a 1000 HP, the truck would just skim the surface like the mud drag trucks do. A guy I used to work with at the 4x4 shop had one, paddle tires, composite wheels, 454 big block with alcohol injection, it was sick.

 

My old 87 hardbody was built pretty good I think, since the time I lifted it and installed 33" mud terrains I think I only got it stuck one time and it was on ice, just couldn't get any traction, I tried everything I could to get off that ice, branches under the tires, dirt, what ever was around, was hard to see as it was at night, finally had to give in and have my wife's friend with her Kia Sportage pull me off the ice, never heard the end of that one !!!

 

Back home in NY we probably went 4 wheeling maybe 3-4 times a week, after work, weekends, late night romps in the woods, the beach, mud holes we had around town. My wife called my hardbody the beast, I was the one pulling other trucks out all the time.

 

So no matter what you have, no matter how you built it, no matter the terrain, you will get stuck, it's almost impossible to build a truck for all the different terrains, and as you said the "redneck trucks" with the 54" tractor tires do get stuck as well.

 

We were four wheeling one time down here in Orlando, FL. a place they called Sea world, some mud holes that ran along the power lines, My friend and I stayed in the sand I don't like going mudding in what looks more like a lake, but there was one guy who had like a 54 Ford, huge tires, just sitting there watching everyone and I asked him why he wasn't playing in the mud? He said if I get stuck there's no one here that could pull me out, got to know your limitations I guess !!! LOL

[msavides]

when I first got my 2nd Pathfinder did not wheel the first one at all) I took it out wheeling stock. I got stuck a few times (from high centering mostly) just trying to get to a few placed to camp and hang out Up near Long Barn California. I figure a suspension lift wan in order. I got new T-bars and cranked them up and got dome v8 jeep grand cherokee springs in the back. That was all I needed. Bit it was too late I had already caught the upgrade bug. Next thing you know it was 31 Cooper M/T, Arb Bumper, Body lift, Winch, then front and rear arb lockers.

 

I have not got stuck since, Mind you I have not went out looking for trouble, but the truck takes me where I want to go and for the most part is really surprises me where is takes me.

Edited June 11, 2013 by msavides

[theexbrit]

 

 

 

 

 

Yes. I totally agree. Even though that older WD21 Pathy is in the way, it is one nice looking rig. Don't you have a better shot of her?

 

:laugh:

 

Hey Greg!!

Yeah, everything you have said is absolutely true, anything can get stuck if you try, although some put up a damn good fight! The reality comes in 3 levels AFAIC.

That are you trying to do/where are you trying to go?

My version of wheeling is more expedition style where you get no points for breaking things or getting stuck, there might not be anyone to get you out! I pick my line carefully and look for the easy way...

Nothing against the mud boggers or rock crawlers, they are just different sports AFAIC.

 

Fair enough Bud, it's your truck and you know what you want it for. I will play devils advocate though...

Rims and tires: Wider rims for a more stable stance and some aggressive AT or even mild MT tires will make the biggest difference there is. The wider rims help keep the body off of obstacles...

Mild suspension lift: Rear coils and cranking the T-bars/alignment. 2" benefit for less than $200

Swap in an LSD rear if you do not have it already

Good recovery points, meaning dual hooks up front and a good point in the rear...

 

You don't have to dive into every mudhole you see, but a little bit upgrade will make the pathy far more capable!

Here is my example. Ignore the bumper and it has a 2" body lift as well as a suspension lift so -2" at the wheel wells, otherwise those are 15x8" rims with 31" tires on it. Not remotely overdone and perfectly drivable every day, yet quite capable offroad.

Did I lose any classic lines?

 

B

 

I'm with B, I'm more into the expedition/go see what's over that hill type of froading. Some guys have really nice, clean looking trucks but I decided to go "Ghetto" with mine. It had some scratches & the paint job was not at it's best when I bought it, so I decided to just make it functional & not really care about what it looks like. There's been a couple of jokes because I've not made any attempt to keep my truck looking "pretty", but I don't care, it has gone everywhere I've ever wanted to go & has never let me down. I don't use it for a daily driver, so I don't need to keep it respectable. I really love my Pathy, on the expedition trips I organize we have all kinds of amazingly (read expensively) upgraded Heep's, Yoyta's, etc, & my Pathy goes everywhere they go (usually I'm in front) albeit sometimes with a door ding or two!!

Every person has their own idea of what they want from their rig, some want to keep it pretty much stock (such as yourself, stioc, karmann, etc) & that's cool. It's surprising what a stock-ish vehicle can do with the right driver. For those that want to rock crawl, etc, they obviously need a different set up from us expedition types so their trucks will be geared to that style. There's no right or wrong, no better rig, etc, it's all down to personal choice & what you intend to use the truck for. B is correct though in that a small lift, bigger tires, etc, will enhance the trucks capabilities & if you can do a good job (as precise & others have done) to make your rig capable without making it look like a clowns car (such as mine ) then kudos to you. It's your truck bro, you have it looking how you want it to look & if it does what you want it to do then it's a good truck.

Edited June 11, 2013 by theexbrit

[unccpathfinder]

Just remember... if u r offroading there is always the chance to get stuck...all it takes is a belt to jump, no spare or even just hitting a soft spot that ends up being 2' deep but dry on the surface...I would reccomend always having some tools, spare parts and some means of recovery be it another vehicle, winch, high lift, come a long etc and so on