beastpath Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 After doing my head gasket repair I have four issues that I need some advice on. I don't know if some are related or not. Timing is good, and I have cleaned the MAF sensor. I have a new rotor and cap but havent put them on yet. The radiator, t-belt, and waterpump are new also. 1. My temperature keeps going up to just over the halfway mark. It used to stay well before the halfway mark previously, even when the A/C was on full blast. In fact, just after I did my head gasket it was running at normal temps, but somehow the fan ripped off the waterpump and cracked my radiator. So then I replaced my waterpump and radiator and now it runs slightly too hot. 2. My amperage is being weird. It runs down to about 13amps when at idle or stopped at a light, and less if any accessories are on. Goes back up to 14 if I'm driving. Seeing as the waterpump and the alty share the same belt, could these two probs be related in that the belt is too tight, or too loose? 3. When I startup cold my rpms run a little low, about 650-700. If I turn on the AC to full, and then turn the wheel at a stop, she stalls a lot of the time. Also when I drive off from a cold startup she stumbles occasionally. Sometimes I think I can smell gas occasionally too. I have adjusted the idle speed, and now when fully warm she idles at about 800; this did not help cold starts as far as I can tell. 4. To top this off I have lost about 2mpg, from 16mpg to 14mpg(those are so low already because the roof rack I put on created a lot of drag). Could these be related too? I've ordered new plugs also for when I do the cap and rotor. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 1. burp it... or loose belt on fan 2. loose belt on alt 3. 600-700 is about right.. re adjust the idle to where it was before.. this could be a timing issue.. 4. see all the above first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 6, 2009 Author Share Posted July 6, 2009 thanks 94, how tight should the belt be exactly? and when burping the nose of the truck should be in the air right? i read in the FSM that 750 was the ideal idle speed for these beasts, so id like to get as close to that as possible. should it idle faster at startup though than after its been running a while? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Is your MAF sensor clean? On mine the idle would dip very low when it was cold and be sputtery until it was warmed up. After replacing it after it totally went out on me, the cold start idle is as perfect as it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 yeah, i cleaned it with rubbing alchohol and a qtip and then left it to air dry. there was no dirt on it really anyways. when i wiggle the MAF wires it doesnt do anything either. does it show up as a code if it is going bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 3) Idle should be higher at cold start, 700-800rpm warm. Sounds like you have something not working right. I don't know the TBIs well, but isn't there a cold idle valve or something?? Have you run the ECU codes? 4) 14mpg is bad. Driving habits or MAF/O2 issue? 2) I think the alt is getting tired. Yes, they put out less juice at lower RPM, so the decline you see normal but may be excessive. Check your battery connections and ground also. 1) Yep, burp it. The belt could be loose but I doubt that is the issue. 1/2 inch of deflection (back and forth total at the middle of the longest distance between pulleys with light force) is where I set belts then go back and tighten up if they bark at start up. Overtight belts will ruin bearings and bushings. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 (edited) 3) Idle should be higher at cold start, 700-800rpm warm. Sounds like you have something not working right. I don't know the TBIs well, but isn't there a cold idle valve or something?? Have you run the ECU codes? 4) 14mpg is bad. Driving habits or MAF/O2 issue? 2) I think the alt is getting tired. Yes, they put out less juice at lower RPM, so the decline you see normal but may be excessive. Check your battery connections and ground also. 1) Yep, burp it. The belt could be loose but I doubt that is the issue. 1/2 inch of deflection (back and forth total at the middle of the longest distance between pulleys with light force) is where I set belts then go back and tighten up if they bark at start up. Overtight belts will ruin bearings and bushings. B 3) there is an air control valve or something, but no adjuster for it. Havent had time to check codes yet, just been trying different things to see if they work first. will check them first thing when I get a chance. 4) my mpg was 18-20 before i put the roof basket and lights on. Then it became 16-17(planned on hooking up the wires to be quick disconnects and then removing the rack until i needed it on there). After the gasket change it lost about 1-2mpg again, so im at 14-16. MAF was just cleaned, 02 sensor is brand new. 2) ill check the grounds and connections, and ill have it checked out at checker. 1) will burp ASAP. was just reading about burping on here, and read that squishy hoses is bad. well they are somewhat squishy so there is probably air in the system. Edited July 7, 2009 by beastpath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY1PATH Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 how tight should the belt be exactly? each belt, allong the longest strech of belt, should not be easily depressed more than 1" when pushing on the back-side-center between 2 pulleys. This is also called " 1" maximum belt deflection." and that is the tightness standard given by the FSM. 2) many parts places test alty's for free. I would def be weary if the alty cannot provide more than 12.5 under full load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 I would def be weary if the alty cannot provide more than 12.5 under full load. at load do you mean while driving or when stopped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamzan Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Full load is when everything is on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 (edited) yeah, i cleaned it with rubbing alchohol and a qtip and then left it to air dry. there was no dirt on it really anyways. when i wiggle the MAF wires it doesnt do anything either. does it show up as a code if it is going bad? No code, but try taking a hard pick or scraper of some sort and cleaning the actual plug clip and prongs in there as well. Sometimes a small coating of corrosion can build up and really mess things up. I think it'd be worth a shot. I didn't think my MAF sensor had anything at all to do with my low idle until I replaced it and cleaned the clip and what not. Warm, mine idles at 700 in drive. When it's cold, it's around 850. The screw facing the sky and attached to the throttle linkage on the throttle body is the cold idle adjustment, the one facing west and sideways is the warm idle screw. Adjusting the cold idle screw when it's warm will do nothing. Edited July 7, 2009 by Kingman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 ok, ill try cleaning out the plug too, good idea. maybe a couple of bursts of electrical cleaner would help too. 700 idle in drive you say? what about in N? i didnt think the VG30E had a cold idle adjust, but i will check again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I do that every time! I knew you didn't have a TBI lol. I keep spacing that...so yeah just ignore that... In N cold it's at 1100 and in drive it's usually 950-1100 when it's warm depending on it's mood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 have you checked your timing? i highy doubt that idle or any other thing is your problem all of a sudden.. you messed with the heads thus you had to mess with the dizzy.. MAF is a possibility; timing would explain most of your other issues also. i'm thinking my cold idle is about 800-1000 and warmed up 600-700.. under load (D or 1st) and warm it dips to maybe 500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 lol, no worries, was getting confused myself. isnt that really high for an idle speed though? does it affect your gas miliage? i could easily turn it up that much, but FSM says 700-800 in N while warm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 It affected it when my sensor went out and it was idling at 1700 in drive and 3000 in N! Like 94 said, timing is more probably but every little thing helps. Rule out as much as you can, and even if the MAF sensor isn't the problem at least the connections are clean. Bad timing can also make your engine run a little hotter as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 have you checked your timing? i highy doubt that idle or any other thing is your problem all of a sudden.. you messed with the heads thus you had to mess with the dizzy.. MAF is a possibility; timing would explain most of your other issues also. i'm thinking my cold idle is about 800-1000 and warmed up 600-700.. under load (D or 1st) and warm it dips to maybe 500. ok, warmed up is about the same as mine, dips to about that in D too. just the cold idle is buggered. pretty sure timing is right on. TDC when i put it together again, counted teeth etc, no loss of power driving, sounds smooth. used timing gun to get 15 btdc. and it wasnt overheating before the waterpump incident, which was after the head gasket stuff. but it still had the cold idle prob. ill play with the dizzy a bit too and see if advancing or retarding the timing helps any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I don't know the TBIs well, but isn't there a cold idle valve or something?? Sorry, I don't know why I thought you had one of those relics... B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KovemaN Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 (edited) When I startup cold my rpms run a little low, about 650-700. If I turn on the AC to full, and then turn the wheel at a stop, she stalls a lot of the time. Since your fan ripped off violently you could have severed one or more wires. Does your idle kick up when you turn the AC on? Without the AC does your idle kick up when you turn the steering wheel? The power steering pressure sensor wiring would be vulnerable to a flying fan blade. Also, did you happen to replace your thermostat when you fixed everything? My temp guage is centered at 180 which is the standard thermostat temp. With the the 170 degree thermostat (standard in hot climates) my truck sits at about 1/4 - 1/3 on the guage. You may also benefit from replacing the coolant temp sensor. It should throw a code if it's not working properly though. Any codes? Edited July 7, 2009 by KovemaN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 he said no codes.. and i don't agree on the idle jumping when you turn the wheels all the way to one side.. the idle will go down under the load. same goes for AC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamzan Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 My idle will jump when the a/c compressor cycles on. I find if you're not holding the brakes firmly enough it will actually make the truck lurch a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KovemaN Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 he said no codes.. and i don't agree on the idle jumping when you turn the wheels all the way to one side.. the idle will go down under the load. same goes for AC. I guess I missed the part about no codes. He didn't ever say he tried pulling them. There definitely is a pressure switch in the PS system that tells the computer to kick up the idle when the pump is working hard. Same goes for the AC. The AC clutch trigger wire also signals the ECU to bump up the idle. Either of those could be disconnected and it could cause the vehicle to stall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 nope.. my bad.. he's trying other stuff first..hmm.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Yes the idle raises a bit when certain things are on, AC, rear defrost, and brights. The idle usually dips a slight bit when the blower motor is on full, the normal headlights are on, and you're turning at full lock. None of those should ever cause a stall unless the idle is way too low for it to carry the tax load, like 300 RPM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beastpath Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 Drove her back and forth to college today WITHOUT the A/C on (which was like hell btw, 108+ Phx heat) and the temperature guage stayed about the 1/3 mark, maybe a little higher. So that is good. I would think that rules out faults in the actual cooling system and points to the accessories being the problem. T-stat is new too, and is working. Was going to "burp" her when I got home, but when I opened the hood I saw there is a chunk missing from the Fan/Alternator belt. So will definitely be replacing that tomorrow. Also checked how tight the belts are. The Fan/Alt belt and A/C belt are probably a little too tight. All the wires to everything are connected, but I will make sure I clean all the connections too, and that everything is connected to the right place, lol. Like you said Kingman, it shouldnt stall. In drive I'm around 5-550 rpm, when I kick the A/C on 450-500, and when I turn the wheel(at a stop) it kicks down to about 300 and stalls. Again this is only after shes only just been turned on. So, just garaged her until tomorrow when I have some time to work on her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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