1994SEV6 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 (edited) Keep in mind that this isn't new. I read my post and realized I didn't really say when this problem was occurring. Most of the people with complaints had 2001-2005ish Tacomas. Some people as far back as 1995 were also complaining though. So this topic isn't anything new, and you may have heard of it. I just saw it on the internet and never heard of it. I thought it was very interesting. I was on Yahoo answers last night. I saw this guy had a question about his Toyota Tacoma with the 2.7l tapping. It had around 140k miles on it. He provided a pretty crappy description (like most of them do), and it sounded like he had a pretty typical lifter tap or something of that nature. Usually, some engines have trademark, common problems. The vg30e has exhaust manifold stud problems, for example. So I google "Toyota 2.7l tapping" and BAM, I get buried in results. So, apparently, Toyota ain't so perfect. I knew they had a few problems here and there, like everybody does, but for the most part I thought they were prim and proper. They were on top for a reason, you know? No way! So I ended up on a few Toyota forums. Floods of 50+ people, one after another, all confirming this problem. Now, they had a different problem that produced the same symptoms. I just stumbled upon this problem, but the Yahoo answers guy might have this problem. So the scariest part is, All these people (in the thousands) had this god awful tapping/knocking. As you know, some forum buffs know what they are talking about. Some of these people were certified mechanics themselves, and they were swearing up and down that this noise was something sinister like a main bearing knock (oh boy). Here's where it gets scary, about 90% of the people had this problem develop within 5k miles of the truck being driven off the lot. Brand new. I thought these people were crazy. No way that a Toyota truck would have a serious problem such as a rod knock within 2000 miles of being brand new. But then, it was repeated. "2000 miles brand new". "7500 miles." "5000 miles". "the day I drove it off the lot with 8 miles it had the knock." So at this point, I'm laughing my ass of, I'm concerned, and I'm very smug. It's just funny that the all-perfect "super reliable" Toyota is having probably the most serious problem ever. I'm pretty concerned. My brother has a Toyota with the 2.7l. But then I remembered he has 285k miles on it and it runs perfect. But I was also concerned for these people on the forums. I was smug because of why these people bought Toyotas in the first place. So then posts start flooding in about people taking this problem to the dealers. There is where it gets really good. You know what the dealers said? "What knocking? We don't hear anything." And from what I understand, it's like the exhaust manifold stud knocking. It drives you crazy and you can hear it from a mile away. So if you can finally get your dealer to finally acknowledge the problem, then they offer to replace your brand new (less than 10000miles!!!) engine with a refurbished shortblock. All of this without even admitting that there is a problem. Sounds like Toyota got one over on them pretty good. I wonder whatever happened to these people. I guess that's what happens when you try to take the "safe and sure" route. Shoulda got that Nissan. I thought this would just be funny to share. It really goes to show how stuff changes. Edited December 7, 2011 by 1994SEV6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunya Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 All have their issues, remember Toyotas of the same vintage as say a wd21 have the same frame rot issues AS wd21s. But... Toyota did put a recall and was buying back cancerous ones for decent coin. We have to patch or junk ours (heck Toyota actually had a recall and was free replacing centerlinks, why couldnt we get that on 15+ year old trucks?!) now my 4runner may seem unreliable as I bich and complain every time it needs fuel or a lightbulb and I bought it with a "common" issue (3.0 truck with headgasket failure) it actually is a fairly reliable truck. Pop onto yotatech and you can see they have their uniqueness just as a Nissan does but they actually share similar issues within the same ranges as we have. Somewhere in there I had a point, but I forgot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1994SEV6 Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 All have their issues, remember Toyotas of the same vintage as say a wd21 have the same frame rot issues AS wd21s. But... Toyota did put a recall and was buying back cancerous ones for decent coin. We have to patch or junk ours (heck Toyota actually had a recall and was free replacing centerlinks, why couldnt we get that on 15+ year old trucks?!) now my 4runner may seem unreliable as I bich and complain every time it needs fuel or a lightbulb and I bought it with a "common" issue (3.0 truck with headgasket failure) it actually is a fairly reliable truck. Pop onto yotatech and you can see they have their uniqueness just as a Nissan does but they actually share similar issues within the same ranges as we have. Somewhere in there I had a point, but I forgot I know. Nothing is perfect. I think people judge car manufacturers by the less number of problems their cars have. People usually view Toyota at the top of that list I would say. Oh yeah, I know about that frame rust thing. Yeah, 1.5x the blue book value ain't horrible though. I'm sure they have their problems, such as headgasket failures, just like Nissan has some, but this one was pretty big. I mean, motors were having these rod knock-like sound within their first 5000 miles. And Toyota was just like "what are you talking about? We can't hear that jackhammer of an engine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverton Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Toyotas fetch good money, thats for sure. But they really arent all that they are cracked up to be. Almost every engine has head gasket problems. My 85 supra's, i had more than one, that engine has a TOTAL of 14 head bolts for an inline 6. The VG30E has THIRTEEN per head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1994SEV6 Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) Oh yeah. The 2jz head gasket issue. The problem isn't the design, it's the torque on the bolts. Toyota put out a certain number for the proper amount of torque, and that number was wrong. If you don't want to blow head gaskets I think you had to overtorque the head bolts by like 30ft lbs (a very significant amount) and undertorque some other bolts by like 5ft lbs, but those weren't as important. I know this Guy who works at the AAP by my house. He says he is on his 5th 2jz engine. His supra is pretty disgusting. Everything about it is broken or messed up somehow. Idk what's up with that Guy. Oh yeah he didn't buy the Turbo model, he said "Nah, I didn't want the Turbo. I have my own engineering plans " just so you can understand this Guy's frame of mind Almost forgot, even to this day more than 25 years later, Toyota denies the problem. The good part is that the 2jz engnes are really good if you solve that head gasket issue Edited December 8, 2011 by 1994SEV6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverton Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Oh yeah. The 2jz head gasket issue. The problem isn't the design, it's the torque on the bolts. Toyota put out a certain number for the proper amount of torque, and that number was wrong. If you don't want to blow head gaskets I think you had to overtorque the head bolts by like 30ft lbs (a very significant amount) and undertorque some other bolts by like 5ft lbs, but those weren't as important. I know this Guy who works at the AAP by my house. He says he is on his 5th 2jz engine. His supra is pretty disgusting. Everything about it is broken or messed up somehow. Idk what's up with that Guy. Oh yeah he didn't buy the Turbo model, he said "Nah, I didn't want the Turbo. I have my own engineering plans " just so you can understand this Guy's frame of mind Almost forgot, even to this day more than 25 years later, Toyota denies the problem. The good part is that the 2jz engnes are really good if you solve that head gasket issue Wrong again. It's the 7M engine that has that problem. they changed the material of the head gasket just as the final plans were being put together and shipped out for the motors to be built and assembled. but the memo that the torque spec needed to be much higher was misplaced somewhere, is what I reckon. "Did you get that memo?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverton Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Oh yeah. The 2jz head gasket issue. The problem isn't the design, it's the torque on the bolts. Toyota put out a certain number for the proper amount of torque, and that number was wrong. If you don't want to blow head gaskets I think you had to overtorque the head bolts by like 30ft lbs (a very significant amount) and undertorque some other bolts by like 5ft lbs, but those weren't as important. I know this Guy who works at the AAP by my house. He says he is on his 5th 2jz engine. His supra is pretty disgusting. Everything about it is broken or messed up somehow. Idk what's up with that Guy. Oh yeah he didn't buy the Turbo model, he said "Nah, I didn't want the Turbo. I have my own engineering plans " just so you can understand this Guy's frame of mind Almost forgot, even to this day more than 25 years later, Toyota denies the problem. The good part is that the 2jz engnes are really good if you solve that head gasket issue Wrong again. It's the 7M engine that has that problem. they changed the material of the head gasket just as the final plans were being put together and shipped out for the motors to be built and assembled. but the memo that the torque spec needed to be much higher was misplaced somewhere, is what I reckon. "Did you get that memo?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Dont 2.7 yotas have adjustable valves? Valves will tap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tungsten Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 A Toyota is a cheap car. Some run forever and some don't run at all. They are really hit or miss vehicles. A WD21 on the other hand is not a cheap vehicle. It was expensive from Day 1 and still is expensive to buy even used in good condition. Think of a WD21 as a Japanese G-wagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverton Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 A Toyota is a cheap car. Some run forever and some don't run at all. They are really hit or miss vehicles. A WD21 on the other hand is not a cheap vehicle. It was expensive from Day 1 and still is expensive to buy even used in good condition. Think of a WD21 as a Japanese G-wagon. WD21's are expensive? I must have missed that memo. I bought my first for $725, and got my current one for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tungsten Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Just look at how much they were back in the day compared to other trucks and cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunya Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 don't see where wd21s are "expensive" not to belittle Nissan or Praise Toyota but cost is how a lot of people end up here while looking for a Toyota. They usually have a higher resale value and hold it better for some reason (whether anyone here personally thinks they should is another topic) and the 3VZ-E is the other HG prone engine (which Toyota ALSO recalled and would do the 1st job on them, afterwards it's on you though, and expensive if your paying someone to do it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tungsten Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 That's a good point, they do have higher resale just like Hondas. That doesn't make them better cars though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunya Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 That doesn't make them better cars though! now I didn't say anything about that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Hey now, Toyota makes a pretty good forklift... B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunya Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Daewoo makes a decent microwave too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1994SEV6 Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 Just look at how much they were back in the day compared to other trucks and cars. I think they were actually really expensive. appparently, a 1994 LE 4WD pathfinder was $30k MSRP. That's more expensive than a lot of cars even now. The XE 2WD was $19.5k, and the XE 4WD was $21.3k just for comparison. Also, a 1996 300zx was getting close to 50 grand new. Nissans were actually very pricey vehicles. And from what I've seen on these forums, there can be a LOT nicer/better than I thought. I think they are some of the best vehicles ever made. I hate resale value. On anything. To me, it just seems that some people pull this price out of thin air. I don't understand why Toyotas would have high resale value. They are so bland. There's nothing to them. I guess they are just desirable because people think they last forever. For some reason, I think Nissan flies under the radar. It's always "TOYOTA AND HONDA!!!" yeah yeah. Toyota!! Yeah!! HONDA!! I don't see Toyota or Honda having any sort of gain/advantage over Nissan. I don't understand why Nissan flies under the radar when they should be receiving enormous praise for making such amazing vehicles. The 720, WD21, D21, and other models I'm not even aware of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1994SEV6 Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 LOL. I love it when companies make random ass products. Hey now, Toyota makes a pretty good forklift... B I had no idea Toyota made forklifts. I always thought of them as the single-minded Jap car maker. Honda makes..EVERYTHING, Mitsubishi makes EVERYTHING and more, Yamaha makes bikes, pianos, guitars, and sheet music (go figure), Nissan makes their vehicles and the UD tractor trailers and other stuff too. I'm sure there are others..Oh yeah, Hitachi makes stuff you wouldn't believe. As you can see, Japanese car manufactuers venture into lots of other fields, but I've never seen Toyota do that. Daewoo makes a decent microwave too... Lol. Well, at least they can do one thing right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Hey now, Toyota makes a pretty good forklift... B Yeah, but they got 4.3 gm v6's in them. Derated too 90hp but still. wd21's where exspensive, 28k was the starting point in 95 for a 4x4 auto xe. Which was more then a suburban at the time. Now suburbans are 50k and Xterras are 26k new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesRich Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Hey now, Toyota makes a pretty good forklift... B So does Nissan! Daewoo makes a decent microwave too... Daewoo makes guns too, I have a Daewoo DP-51 9mm that was the first to come out with a triple action trigger. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamzan Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Nissan makes a good stainless coffee mug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Didn't know about Daewoo microwaves or guns, but my coffee grinder is Krups, and they made artilery... Sorry about the TJ. I don't mind that the older Nissans are under valued, that means they are cheaper to buy!! B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I had no idea Toyota made forklifts. I always thought of them as the single-minded Jap car maker. Honda makes..EVERYTHING, Mitsubishi makes EVERYTHING and more, Yamaha makes bikes, pianos, guitars, and sheet music (go figure), Nissan makes their vehicles and the UD tractor trailers and other stuff too. I'm sure there are others..Oh yeah, Hitachi makes stuff you wouldn't believe. As you can see, Japanese car manufactuers venture into lots of other fields, but I've never seen Toyota do that. Yep, had a Toyota forklift at Les Schwab. Yamaha also makes badass engines for cars. Yeah, but they got 4.3 gm v6's in them. Derated too 90hp but still. All of the ones I've seen have an inline 4 propane engine. So does Nissan! They also made a few boats too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tungsten Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Yep, had a Toyota forklift at Les Schwab. Yamaha also makes badass engines for cars. Ford Taurus SHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 All of the ones I've seen have an inline 4 propane engine. The big ones have propain powered 4.3 vortecs in them. The 7 series I believe. The 4 poppers are probly hercules engines. http://www.toyotaforklift.com/product/InternalCombustionCushionTireLiftTrucks/7Seriesctlc.aspx I'd rather have one with a 4-71 thumper in it myself, but puking oil and black smoke would get old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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