Kittamaru Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 (edited) I'm thinking of doing an A/T to M/T swap on my '90... reason being is the A/T is good, and I figure I might as well see what i can get for it, and I'd rather have an M/T anyways... just preference I guess. My question is this: IS there a 6 speed M/T that'll mate up to the '90 WD21? If not, how can one be procured/made/designed/whatever, and what would it cost? This is a VERY long term project, but I figure previous planning and all that... Edited December 9, 2009 by Kittamaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimGreg Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 I they never used any 6 speeds behind VG blocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edicer2 Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 (edited) hmm i always thought for some reason the z32 300zx had a 6 speed option and that i know on my z31 forum people have used the z32 tranny on their z31 (vg30e/t). Idont think it was a complete drop in bolt up but i thought it was fairly simple i can look around. but im pretty sure there was one for the z32 tho. edit: nvm it was the s15 with the sr20 motor has a 6speed and uses basically the same tranny as a z31 i think(my short @!*%er also works on a tranny from a 240sx and my friend with a 240sx used his ka tranny wit hhis sr and it bolted up so i am assuming they are close) Edited December 9, 2009 by edicer2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 I was pretty happy with the 5 speed, 6 just sounds like extra shifting... B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 The main reason I'm looking at six is twofold: Option 1: Tighter gears ratios, keeping your RPM in the "sweet spot" longer, giving better acceleration and power Option 2: Longer gear range, giving you a higher-geared "cruising" gear. Highways around me are getting faster (while the posted limit is 60mph here on I81, the norm is 75-80mph, even for cops AND state troopers...) and having my engine running 3500 rpm isn't exactly what I like... she sounds SO much better purring along at 2500 on the highway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Most 6 speed manuals are geared closely together in the higher gears, usually within 500 RPM of each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 The main reason I'm looking at six is twofold: Option 1: Tighter gears ratios, keeping your RPM in the "sweet spot" longer, giving better acceleration and power Option 2: Longer gear range, giving you a higher-geared "cruising" gear. Highways around me are getting faster (while the posted limit is 60mph here on I81, the norm is 75-80mph, even for cops AND state troopers...) and having my engine running 3500 rpm isn't exactly what I like... she sounds SO much better purring along at 2500 on the highway Ok, I understand where you are coming from. Let me say though, about 75mph seems to be the max 'safe' speed considering the stock vehicle, less of course for lifts, big tires, etc. You know what I mean, so don't bother arguing... What sized tires do you have now? For example, going from 235/75/15 to 31" tires will garner a 7%+ increase. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamzan Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 I'm pretty sure he's stated around here that he has 31s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 (edited) @Precise - I have the same size wheels that came with the truck, but I know the tire shop didn't have the 235/75/15's, so i got 31x10.5's and yeah, I know what you mean mate She does get awful tight at those speeds (steering gets very unforgiving) but she holds steady and with the sweeping highway curves she seems ok with it... though I wouldn't want to try any maneuvers at that speed XD However, I feel really uncomfortable going a lot slower than 99% of the other cars on the road... doing so, I've had people swerve around me (and then cut me off), honk at me, etc... I don't want to be the cause of an accident, even IF I did nothing wrong by going the "posted" speed limit BTW - I am also considering the possibility that my speedo is wrong - when my wife drives her 01 Subaru Legacy GT and I follow her, she reads about 10 mph slower than my speedo when I'm reading 75... but I don't know what would cause that nor how to fix it XD @Kingman - I didn't know that... does that mean my theory is out to pot? PS - Precise, dumb question - do you mean the safe stock limit (given a perfectly clean, mint condition vehicle) for the control system (steering, suspension, brakes, etc) or the engine (overrev issues)? Again, if my speedo is wrong than all my other hypothoses are wrong, and that could be the end of it right here and now Edited December 10, 2009 by Kittamaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY1PATH Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 I had my pathy over 90mph right after I installed my HooHaa CL, it was lifted just over an inch the alignment was good and all sterring compnents were sound. It felt pretty decent but I think I grew a few gray hairs getting to that speed. I also found @ that speed the stock brakes felt useless untill I got below 80 mph(then they started to slow me down). maybe the rotating mass of a 31" tire @ 90mph was just too much for the stock brakes to grab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 When I hit 95 the other day everything still felt tight and calm. There was no jittery-ness or anything, just fast smooth speed. Agreed with Garret though, the brakes were a little lacking until it slowed down to about 80. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 I guess I should come 100% clean: The highest I've EVER had the truck was with the speedo maybe 5 degrees past the 100mph mark... but I know for DAMN sure there's no way the truck could actually do that, could it? I was, admittedly, trying to chase down a Ford Windstar that had just damn near run me off the road - I think it was a windstar... all I know is it was a minivan with a V8 and the plate number was QA3 something. It was when I noticed my tachometer creeping towards 6100 rpm and looked at my speedo starting a second rotation that I realized how fast we were going... and he was STILL pulling away... Granted, the Pathy drove pretty darn well... steering was crisp and sharp, and the engine sounded okay to me. I came off the gas and lightly applied the brakes and she started to slow down nicely. I know there's no way she was really doing 100+ mph... and thinking about that makes me think, again, that it's the speedo... so where do I go from here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Windstars don't have V8s, they have 3.8L V6s, hell no minivan has a V8 in it from the factory. The only vans with V8s in them from Ford are the Econoline series. I would think you could hit 100, my old thing hit 95 with some struggle but it's an older TBI engine with a lot of miles, though it is a manual. You've got an MPFI with a little more power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY1PATH Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Returning from our thread jacking... I want a 6spd too, but I don't think its gonna happen. but I have a plan... after I do my engine upgrade I will be doing "higher Hi and lowere Low"; 4.1 gears from 4x4 parts to reduce higway rpms and lower low range gears for my t-case to my offroad torque won't suffer any from degrading to 4.1 gears. Yeh gears and possibly cases are expensive but so would retrofitting a 6spd to a 4wd and the outcome is similar.(unless you really must have that 6th gear) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 Windstars don't have V8s, they have 3.8L V6s, hell no minivan has a V8 in it from the factory. The only vans with V8s in them from Ford are the Econoline series. I would think you could hit 100, my old thing hit 95 with some struggle but it's an older TBI engine with a lot of miles, though it is a manual. You've got an MPFI with a little more power. It was a ford van (swore it was a minivan) and it had a big ole V8 on the back end... least I thought it did. And the way it left my old gal in the dust lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 Returning from our thread jacking... I want a 6spd too, but I don't think its gonna happen. but I have a plan... after I do my engine upgrade I will be doing "higher Hi and lowere Low"; 4.1 gears from 4x4 parts to reduce higway rpms and lower low range gears for my t-case to my offroad torque won't suffer any from degrading to 4.1 gears. Yeh gears and possibly cases are expensive but so would retrofitting a 6spd to a 4wd and the outcome is similar.(unless you really must have that 6th gear) *ponders* That is a possibility, especially if I get the MT first, refit it, and then install. I dunno, I'm trying to decide between getting a different daily driver (probably a Versa or Altima or something else Nissan with the CVT system) and keeping the Pathy so I can work on her... I do NOT want to get rid of her, but she needs repairs badly that I can't afford to have done right nwo, nor do I have the time to be vehicle-less ( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 PS - Precise, dumb question - do you mean the safe stock limit (given a perfectly clean, mint condition vehicle) for the control system (steering, suspension, brakes, etc) or the engine (overrev issues)? Again, if my speedo is wrong than all my other hypothoses are wrong, and that could be the end of it right here and now I was guesstimating and going by my experiences, and mainly talking abbout vehicle response and braking. It's not like at 85mph a pathy is suddenly going to steer poorly, much less go veering off the road, but the brakes tend to be lacking and any sudden emergency evasive action becomes sketchy. These vehicles were never intended for high speed. As Alkorahil pointed out, when these cars were designed/made, the speed limit was 55mph... As for revving, I'd probably not hold it at more than 4000rpm for any length of time, but that's pretty fast right there. B Oh, the way I check my speedo is the radar boxes. The ones that display your speed as a warning. You have those out there?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreus009 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Also, you can check your speedo with a GPS system. With 31" tires my GPS says I'm doing 75mph when the speedo says 70mph. I've had mine to around 95 or 100 (quite frankly I was keeping my eyes on the road) but not until after exhaust modifications. Before the exhaust mods I'd be lucky if I could hold 80 mph. In my opinion, anything above 85 mph and things start getting sketchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 (edited) As for revving, I'd probably not hold it at more than 4000rpm for any length of time, but that's pretty fast right there 4000 RPM is right in the pwoer band of these engines, therefore it's when it's at it's most efficient operation and where it's "happiest". Remember, the old '86.5-'87 3 speed automatics held 4-4.5k consistantly at highway speeds. Edited December 10, 2009 by Kingman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Remember, the old '86.5-'87 3 speed automatics held 4-4.5k consistantly at highway speeds. Yet another reason to completely avoid the 2 doors... B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamzan Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 (edited) I was guesstimating and going by my experiences, and mainly talking abbout vehicle response and braking. It's not like at 85mph a pathy is suddenly going to steer poorly, much less go veering off the road, but the brakes tend to be lacking and any sudden emergency evasive action becomes sketchy. These vehicles were never intended for high speed. As Alkorahil pointed out, when these cars were designed/made, the speed limit was 55mph... As for revving, I'd probably not hold it at more than 4000rpm for any length of time, but that's pretty fast right there. B Oh, the way I check my speedo is the radar boxes. The ones that display your speed as a warning. You have those out there?? I've had mine at 160 km/h and it felt perfectly fine. This was just after I had my whole steering/suspension replaced and alignment done. Also it was revving just below 4k with the 31's. With 235 75 15 tires the brakes work pretty damn good at highway speeds actually. Edited December 10, 2009 by adamzan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packie88 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 btw t case gears arent going to effect anything aside from 4low. and if your going to go with a set get the calmini set alot easier to install over the AC gears Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY1PATH Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 4000 RPM is right in the pwoer band of these engines, therefore it's when it's at it's most efficient operation and where it's "happiest". remember that dyno sheet I showed you? 3500 was my peak torque. I also have a stock dyno from an old nissan ad showing 2800 as peak(iirc) for a 1990. I guess it may also depend on how your exhaust is set up too... that may make it higher... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 (edited) I think my exhaust may be mucking with my power band, as I can feel mine accelerate better between 3500-5000 rpm... my red line starts at 5750 and I've hit the rev limiter once when merging on a short, blind, on-ramp with a semi running up behind me a little uncomfortably quick. She screamed like hell, burned a bit of oil, and shot off like a rocket... after that I made sure to give her a nice wash n wax as a thank you for NOT exploding on me XD But yeah, I feel the most "punch" at around 4k rpm. As for checking my speed: We don't have those on roads over 35mph here, and even there my speedo is off 2-3 mph. And I can't afford a GPS system T-Case gears, I didn't even think about... I guess that would be an issue eh? Aighty then. Is there a reason to swap a 5 speed MT in in place of a 4 speed A/T with Torque Converter lockup? Does MT still have the Torque Converter lockup? *shrugs* I'm mostly looking to squeak a little more umph and/or mpg out of the ole gal, at least until I can get a more efficient DD Edited December 11, 2009 by Kittamaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldSlowReliable Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 If I ever get another pathy for non-4x4ing just driving around, it would be a 5 speed....I can't STAND not having control of the shifting. If I had a manual w/33's it would probably be well mannered on the road cause I could control the rpm's and gearing, when it shifts, and be able to hold it in 1 gear on the highway instead of it jumping around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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