jasenpeters Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 The SUV has been getting noisier over the past 6 months and seems to be related to the transmission.It's so loud you can hear it coming in the neighborhood.Of course, the sound is coming from the clutch/transmission area and is quiet in neutral or in gear with clutch in, ie not moving.The shifting is as easy as it always has been, but the "winding" up sound is getting louder and louder in the past 6 months. Manual transmission fluid is full and relatively clean.Strangely, 4th gear is the quietest, so quiet, in fact, we sometimes drive it in 4th instead of 5th or 3rd if the speed is appropriate.The clutch is 120k miles old and was changed back at about 120k miles.Total miles about 240k on the SUV.We plan on changing the clutch ourselves, and if the noise does not quiet down, we plan on taking it to a transmission specialist, as a rebuild or repair is beyond my desire. (unless it's a simple repair)Any ideas or advice is appreciated.Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 4th gear is direct drive, 1:1 in and out, so I'd guess you have bearings failing. Changing the clutch won't solve the problem, but obviously have it replaced when the tranny is out for a rebuild, it is probably about due anyway. The rebuild shouldn't be too costly, but there is a lot of labor to remove/reinstall the tranny. You could cut the cost in 1/2 if you did that part... There is a TSB in the Garage/TSB section that talks about 'overfilling' the tranny with 5.1 liters of oil to prevent bearing starvation in certain circumstances; this is usually done through the shifter hole. Also, make sure only GL-4 gear oil is used to fill it (or a quality, compatible synthetic like Redline MT-90). These trannys have soft yellow metal bits that will be destroyed by GL-5 or 'back compatible' oils. Welcome to NPORA BTW. B 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasenpeters Posted October 7, 2015 Author Share Posted October 7, 2015 (edited) Thanks Precise1, mine looks likes yours in the picture (a bit cleaner, but not as cool ) Is a rebuild more than just the bearings? I wont hold you to it, but what would you estimate the cost, including removal? (which, btw, I'll definitely do, if it can save a lot) Is the Nissan dealer any better or worse than a strictly transmission shop? How long could one go driving with bad bearings, what could happen, etc? Thanks for the feedback and glad to be here. We love this car and want to keep her going strong. Edited October 7, 2015 by jasenpeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PathyAndTheJets Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 (edited) Sounds like the countershaft bearing. The case could end up getting chewed up, so fixing it sooner rather than later will be much cheaper. A rebuild would be bearings, syncros, replace any damaged gears, seals,and bushings. Depending if you are paying for removal and installation into the vehicle it will be upwards of 2500 bucks. You could probably get away with just replacing the front case bearings. Then you'd be out about 150 bucks for bearings and seals and a weekend to get the transmission in and out, if you've got the tools. Edited October 8, 2015 by PathyAndTheJets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechanicalbaron Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Thanks Precise1, mine looks likes yours in the picture (a bit cleaner, but not as cool ) Is a rebuild more than just the bearings? I wont hold you to it, but what would you estimate the cost, including removal? (which, btw, I'll definitely do, if it can save a lot) Is the Nissan dealer any better or worse than a strictly transmission shop? How long could one go driving with bad bearings, what could happen, etc? Thanks for the feedback and glad to be here. We love this car and want to keep her going strong. If you go to a dealership you will pay a premium and honestly we don't rebuild these very often anymore. The precise 1 is correct on what the problem is, the bulletin is to replace the trans case that has a updated fill hole location that is about 1 inch above the original. Find a reputable trans shop that is well established to replace all the bearings and whatever else may be damaged and make sure they reference the bulletin so they at a minimum can put the right amount of manual trans fluid ( GL4) in it Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Yep, IIRC 1996 was the first year of the revised fill hole location, first year of the R50. Thanks Precise1, mine looks likes yours in the picture (a bit cleaner, but not as cool ) Is a rebuild more than just the bearings? I wont hold you to it, but what would you estimate the cost, including removal? (which, btw, I'll definitely do, if it can save a lot) Is the Nissan dealer any better or worse than a strictly transmission shop? How long could one go driving with bad bearings, what could happen, etc? Thanks for the feedback and glad to be here. We love this car and want to keep her going strong. That is my first one when I was parting it out. The second one is in better shape, but also currently bumperless... Rebuild info has been covered. I'm not going to guess the price because I have no idea what shop/labor rates are in your area, but I'd say removal/installation of the tranny alone would be at least 8-10 hours of shop time. If you have the tools/place to work and suitable experience, I'd think you could save at least 1/2 the cost of the job. Make sure to replace everything in the bell housing (clutch parts), replace (refinish) the flywheel and consider replacing the RMS. You can get great prices on factory parts from Rob Lacy (Alkorahil) who runs an online dealership department out of the Dallas/FT WTH area. Check the Classifieds/Services section for contact information. As MB said above, I'd look for a good independent shop to do the tranny work, and I wouldn't drive too much farther if it howls that badly, they could seize or come apart under load, and that would be bad... Have the shop save the damaged bearing set for you to check out, I think you'll be amazed at how badly worn/brinelled they are. I'm sure you can keep the old girl running quite a bit longer, the record that I have heard of is about 510k miles... When was the last timing belt change? B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 If you're doing it yourself, the writeup on beergarage might come in handy, or at least give you an idea of what you're up against. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasenpeters Posted October 9, 2015 Author Share Posted October 9, 2015 Excellent write up on the re-build! Timing Belt, rear seal, clutch, etc, I can handle and will do while tranny is getting rebuilt. I just rebuilt a '96 Saturn SC2 engine. Tempting to rebuild the Pathfinder transmission, but I'm not sure I have the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasenpeters Posted November 12, 2015 Author Share Posted November 12, 2015 Hey everyone, We brought it to a place here in Austin to get repaired. I decided that, though it looked like a lot of fun to do myself, I did not want to buy all the tools needed for a "Full Kit" rebuild, assuming there were no other issues like gear or shaft damage. However, we did remove the transmission ourselves (we've done it about 8 years ago to replace the clutch) and sent it in for a "bench" job. We saved at least $500 on labour and $400 on parts and services (which included a mandatory flywheel resurface). I do have a few questions if y'all don't mind: 1) If I were to replace the "front case bearings", as per PathyAndTheJets, would this require any special pullers, separators or other tools? From the FSM on the 5Speed V6 2WD FS5R30A type transmission: The front Bearing for the Main Drive Gear is right behind the front cover surrounding the "input Shaft" (Main Drive Gear?). Same location for the Counter Gear Front Bearing. This would be only pertaining to the bearings that may be easily accessible and replacable without having to take apart the whole transmission as in the case for the remaining bearings. Could I also assume that these "front" bearings take the most beating (especially the Main Drive Gear Bearing) because of the proximity to the Input Shaft? There was also some leakage of trans fluid inside the bell housing, which may indicate the MDG Bearing is suffering. 2) Precise1 or anyone else who may know, regarding the Timing Belt Are there other components besides the belt and tensioner? I found a Cloyes and a Gates set at Rock Auto. Any advice is appreciated. 3) Clutch brand? I was looking at Grip Force Stage 2. Or Luk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Sounds like it has been handled well so far... 1) Those bearings/seals should be checked when the tranny is being rebuilt, or simply replaced as part of a kit on principle... 2) When you do the timing belt (105k mile interval for your year) there are other things you can change as well. Since it is over 100k miles, I tend to change everything... cam seals crank seal timing belt tensioner thermostat bypass hose water pump fan clutch Basically, I don't want to touch anything there until the next timing belt change. IIRC, parts for everything cost me under $400 via Alkorahil 3) I just went with the stock Nissan clutch. They last about 150k miles with normal use and are made by Exedy. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasenpeters Posted November 13, 2015 Author Share Posted November 13, 2015 1) I was just wondering, if it is known that only the "front" bearings (ie behind the front cover) need replacing, would it be an easy job, that is, not requiring complex special tools or disassembly of the transmission as with the more "internal" bearings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 1) Sorry, beyond my experience to verify. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PathyAndTheJets Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) The front cover needs to be removed, where the throwout rides, then the front case has to be separated. http://www.midwesttrans.com/fs5r30_parts_ill_p1.jpg Edited November 14, 2015 by PathyAndTheJets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasenpeters Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Thanks P&TJ, that's what I saw on the diagram too. But does it require any special tools to get at without tearing the whole thing apart? Separating the front case (bell house) doesn't seem too bad. The beergarage (link above) guy, takes those "front" bearings off last, for some reason. So when I was reviewing that I assumed you have to take it all apart to get to those particular "front" bearings. But, if taking those "front" bearings off is nothing more than a simple puller (those bearings are at the very end of the shafts) and maybe a clever way to "press" new ones back on, then it should be an easy job, if there is no other significant damage to the tranny. I do understand that you "should" have it all opened up and inspected for a proper rebuild. But for those who know the symptoms and risks, it may be a fix that can get you going without all the special tools for a full job, until you can get the tranny to a shop. I'm not trying to short cut, just survive. Anyway the shop's got it now. But I will never know what the actual issues were, in spite of what they tell me, unless I see it myself. I did ask them to save the "parts", so we'll see. I'm always eager to learn more. Thanks for all the comments. Edited November 14, 2015 by jasenpeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PathyAndTheJets Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Probably a bearing puller, snap ring pliers, socket set, maybe a jig or other person to hold it steady while breaking bolts loose, and some grey rtv for reassembly. As for installation.. A brass drift would probably get it done. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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