tecciball Posted October 10, 2006 Share Posted October 10, 2006 Hey Pathians. So I just got my new Dunlops Rover ATs installed on Sunday at a Firestone/Bridgestone by my house. I also go the lifetime alignment service. Today was the first time I had the vehicle up to highway speeds. Once I hit about 50 or 55, I got quite a bit of vibration in the wheel and a generally rough ride. I have noticed no issues when driving at local speeds. Thoughts? I am gonna go make sure that I have weights on all my wheels. Maybe one came off... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tx_flatlander Posted October 10, 2006 Share Posted October 10, 2006 I would guess that you either lost a weight or you need them re-balanced. at low speeds its not so bad, its when you reach highway speeds that it really comes into play. While im at it, how do you like your new tires? Also, how much did you pay per tire and what size? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted October 10, 2006 Share Posted October 10, 2006 balance would defnitely be my first suspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navygz19 Posted October 10, 2006 Share Posted October 10, 2006 I also go the lifetime alignment service. So I just got my new Dunlops Rover ATs installed on Sunday at a Firestone/Bridgestone by my house. Today was the first time I had the vehicle up to highway speeds. Once I hit about 50 or 55, I got quite a bit of vibration in the wheel and a generally rough ride. I have noticed no issues when driving at local speeds. Thoughts? I am gonna go make sure that I have weights on all my wheels. Maybe one came off... So I just got my new Dunlops Rover ATs installed on Sunday at a Firestone/Bridgestone by my house. First and foremost, I would have taken my business elsewhere but to each his own. They've been known to do shoddy work religously. I also go the lifetime alignment service. Bingo...better take advantage of that and demand those fools to make it right, including a REAL roadtest incorporating highway speeds, that's their jobs after all. Good move getting the lifetime alingment service...$60+ a shot can be expensive. Just watch 'em, make sure they do it right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88pathoffroad Posted October 11, 2006 Share Posted October 11, 2006 Ew, you voluntarily went to a Firestone? D'oh. I second the shoddy work comment. First-hand experience with work trucks. BAD times when you get the truck back from the shop and it's worse than when you took it in. Do not the 00-up wheels need to be mounted on a hub-centric wheel balancer to get them done up properly? I seem to remember something about that being a problem with tire shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted October 11, 2006 Share Posted October 11, 2006 If the balance is OK, it could be an out of round tire. Regardless, take it back and let them make it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 11, 2006 Author Share Posted October 11, 2006 would it be unsafe or damaging to the tires or vehicle to drive it like this? i have some more highway miles tomorrow - 50 or so. as for the shop quality, i have gone there for oil for a while with no issues. but that is such a basic service that it probably doesnt say much. i was most interested in the lifetime alignment service, which i got for 120 (40 off). can anyone else confirm the hub centric wheel balancing issue? as 88 clearly noticed, this is an 01 with the stock SE wheels. i guess i could call the dealer tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 11, 2006 Author Share Posted October 11, 2006 i just went out to check on the weights. there were none on the vehicle. none whatsoever! i am missing something, because i was thinking there should be one on each wheel. also, the rim edges are REALLY f-ed. i know that i had some curb rash before this install, but nothing like this. i will inspect in the morning and take some pics. needless to say, i am pissed. please not too many i told you so's...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5523Pathfinder Posted October 11, 2006 Share Posted October 11, 2006 If they have the right equipment, get them to Match-Balance the wheel and tire. For the bigger tires and wheels, that is the best way to get as much vibration out of the assembly. Make sure they didnt use sticky weights on the inside of the wheel and you just didnt see them. But if they messed up, they should pay to get it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88pathoffroad Posted October 11, 2006 Share Posted October 11, 2006 Yeah, check the inside edge of the wheels for taped-on weights, sometimes they just do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuismO Posted October 11, 2006 Share Posted October 11, 2006 balance would defnitely be my first suspect. yea i agree. when quick vibration only occurs at highway speeds, i'd definitely think of unbalanced wheels from the get go. i had to have my wheels rebalanced after i got my new tires last month as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 11, 2006 Author Share Posted October 11, 2006 (edited) thanks for the responses everyone. i didnt think of inside weights, but i will check for that. i called nissan service this morning and was told that only the 04+ wheels need the hub-centric balancing. i will definitely be taking it back to Firestone asap. in the meantime, is it damaging to wheels/tires/suspension or dangerous to drive at higher speeds with unbalanced wheels? if possible, please weigh in on that issue in the next few hours. i have some field work to do, but i can get someone else to drive if needed. thanks again. Edited October 11, 2006 by tecciball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted October 11, 2006 Share Posted October 11, 2006 how bad is it? i'd say prolonged driving would work out your bjs etc.. dangerous? it shouldn't be if everything is in good shape otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88pathoffroad Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 It's mostly a PITA, not dangerous. Unless the vibration is REAL bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 12, 2006 Author Share Posted October 12, 2006 the shaking is not so bad that it effects my control over the vehicle. i assume that is what you mean by REAL bad. i was able to quickly feel a weight on the inside of one rim, so that must have been there approach. i didnt check them all because it doesnt really matter if they are all there or not. something is not right, and i will not be the one to fix it. back it goes to firestone. maybe tonight. might have to wait until the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattd123 Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 well i went to firestone for new tires and they seemed to do ok except they lost 2 of my lugs and when they flushed the radiator they got it all over the engine and it stunk for a week. but seriously they did a good job on the balancing and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 i took the pathy back to firestone to get it rebalanced, which they said they did. the road vibration is definitely not as bad, but still more than my previous tires which had about 20k mi on them. those were highway tires though. should i expect some vibration from the at style i have now. the new ones are also 1" larger. the vibration seems to be almost nothing at 70+, which would be my normal highway cruising speed. so maybe i should just ignore it. i just dont want to ignore something that might indicate a problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 No, there should not be any "vibration". Audible humming is to be expected, but not vibration. Either they're incompetent or you have an out of round tire. I hate to say it, but I think it's time to take it to someone who knows what they're doing. And pay them to figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 yuck. i was afraid of that! i definitely still get shaking of the steering wheel between 55 and 65. then it stops. by the way, the guy at firestone said that if the tire was out of round, i would notice the vibration at much lower speeds. the said further that it is common for misbalanced tires to only noticeable vibrate at highway speeds because the harmonics are amplified enough to notice at the higher speed. does this hold water? sounded reasonable to me, but i an no engi-nerd. just a lowly scientist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Generally, yes. But, there are exceptions. A significantly out of round tire will be noticed at lower speeds, but a slightly out of round behaves very much like an out of balance condition. Each of them cause a "hop" exactly once every revolution, so you can see how they can behave similarly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecciball Posted October 18, 2006 Author Share Posted October 18, 2006 so any suggestion on what they are doing wrong on the balancing. or how to determine if a tire is out of round? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeevO Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 the bushings in your steering system must be shot.. you also might want to get a steering stabilizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 To check for roundness, I just watch the tire while it is spinning on the balancer. This at least spots serious defects. It won't catch internal defects that only materialize when a load is applied, but it catches obvious stuff. The balancer operator at a good shop would be watching the tire as they balance. At the average shop, the operator is counting the boogers under his fingernails... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 On the balancing part of it: It is POSSIBLE that you have some kind of higher order imbalance problem - which comes from side to side variations in weight, or heavy-light-heavy-light problems at 90 degree intervals. There are basically 3 kinds of balancers - Static, cheap dynamic, and high end dynamic. Dynamic meaning a spin balancers. The static and cheap dynamic balancers do the same thing - have the operator put a weight opposite the heaviest point. That is good enough 90% of the time - especially at lower speeds. BUT, it does not take into account "side to side" or diagonal imbalances. The high end dynamic balancers do. They not only tell the operator to put the weight on a certain area of the wheel, but whether to put it on the inside edge or outside edge. They also instruct to put 2 weights on at 120 degree intervals instead of 1 at 180. This avoids the heavy-light-heavy-light problem at 90 degree intervals, which causes a 2nd order vibration (2 cycles per revolution) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88pathoffroad Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 the bushings in your steering system must be shot.. you also might want to get a steering stabilizer. It's kinda tough to put a SS on rack-and-pinion steering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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