Indigent Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Well, I have both heads off and found that my LH head gasket was definitely bad. I have finished cleaning everything up, and have the gasket set on order (should be in tomorrow...). In this process, I found something wierd with the #6 cyl. It isn't travelling up all of the way. All of the rest of them come right up to the top, but #6 just barely doesn't make it. There is no valve damage on the head, so I don't really know what happened. My question is, how bad is it going to affect the engine? I know that that cylinder won't have as much compression as it needs, but I don't know the overall effect it will have. Here is a pic of it: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88pathoffroad Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Could be a slightly bent rod from inhaling water, but I would think it'd make some kind of noise. You never can tell though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Weird... how much lower than the others is it? If you know the engine has definitely never been repaired (new rod or new piston) and it was not making scary knocking noises, then the only thing I could think of is exactly what Aaron said - a bent rod. Which would make me nervous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigent Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 I know absolutely nothing about this vehicle's past. nothing in carfax either. It is obviously a rod, but I guess I am wondering if I should pull the engine and fix it, or just leave it the hell alone. I really don't want the headache of taking the motor out and tearing it down. I would rather get a new rig. I am wondering if the engine will run ok with it like this. Every other cylinder comes all the way up, but that #6 one just doesn't quite make it. indigent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 How difficult would it be to replace that single rod? I thought you could do it thru the top of the head if you were careful...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Changing the rod requires removing the rod bolts. Which means dropping the oil pan. Which raises the PITA factor. A lot. As much as I love my pathies, I really disliked pulling the engine - definitely not one of the easiest vehicles to pull engines from. Things are tight in there. Do you have any idea when the theoretical water ingestion occurred? If it has been run for thousands of miles like this, it could likely go thousands more. These things are tough! I would suggest NOT revving it to redline... If the rod is bent, it will add a little imbalance. So failure would be more likely at higher RPM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigent Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 I don't even know if it is from water damage. The head gasket was not sealing correctly by that cylinder, so I assume that coolant got in there. This pathy ran like crap when I bought it. I only paid $1000 for it, hoping it would be an easy fix. It is looking less and less likely that that is the case. The truck has 189000 miles on it, and I have no idea how long it has been like this. I am thinking about taking my chances and putting it back together in this condition, but am definitely concerned. That cylinder was off on the compression test when I did it a while back, and now I know why. Any gurus have any thoughts? How long do you think I can run it like that? I basically want to get it in good running order for a while to save up for either a new engine or bide my time until an SE shows up on a lot in town. indigent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowTied Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Was it smoking white smoke at all while running? I have seen this when coolant is getting burned up.... If it was just a sepage, I doubt that would hydro lock it. If it was not knocking before, and you plan to deal it, try it with the new head. It is a gamble... are you a "pay it now" or a "pay it later" kinda person? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yozsi Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 i've seen bent rods from hydrolocking it from a blown head gasket. happens when a dumb ass tries to start it and the cylinder is full of water. id just run it, you'll never notice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigent Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 (edited) i've seen bent rods from hydrolocking it from a blown head gasket. happens when a dumb ass tries to start it and the cylinder is full of water. id just run it, you'll never notice. That's what I was looking for. I realize it will cause issues down the road, but I don't really plan on having it forever. Like I said I really want an SE. Like a dumbass, I didn't do research before buying it. I just came from Japan, where I had a TD27T, and I didn't realize that there were even differences between the SE and the XE. Mainly electric shock control and rear disc brakes... I don't plan on doing anything too extreme with this one, and I only drive it about 20 miles a day. If anyone else has some input or prior experience with this situation, any advice would be great. I would be willing to change the piston if I can do it with the block still in. I don't have the energy or time for an engine pull right now. If it comes down to me HAVING to, then that's not a big deal, but if it isn't necessary (i.e. i can run with it like this OK) then I am not going to tear it apart further. I think what happened is the jackass that had it before me did the head gasket and OVER torqued the head bolts. I really hate it when people don't follow the simplest of instructions; especially when it is on something so damned important. I guess I got what I paid for, but it would have been nice to find something a bit easier to deal with. hehe. Was it smoking white smoke at all while running? I have seen this when coolant is getting burned up.... If it was just a sepage, I doubt that would hydro lock it. If it was not knocking before, and you plan to deal it, try it with the new head. It is a gamble... are you a "pay it now" or a "pay it later" kinda person? It wasn't smoking badly enough to make me think it was a leaky head gasket, but it did smoke some. The oil was also milky when I drained it for this head teardown process, so that is a pretty dead giveaway. Also, I was losing coolant constantly. There was no puddle in my driveway or garage, but it was definitely going somewhere (I assume while I was driving...). If it was hydrolocked, wouldn't it have some valve damage or something? I have checked out the head, and it seems fine. No bent valve or anything. I am typically a pay for it now person, because my budget allows me to be, but in this case I am tired enough of this thing to just say screw it. indigent. Edited February 19, 2008 by Indigent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 That cylinder was off on the compression test when I did it a while back, and now I know why.the compression was low not because of depressed piston but because of the blown gasket. I have checked out the head, and it seems fine. No bent valve or anything.just because it looks fine doesn't mean it is. I don't have the energy or time for an engine pull right now. If it comes down to me HAVING to, then that's not a big deal, but if it isn't necessaryif a girl on here can do it, why can't you? hehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigent Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 the compression was low not because of depressed piston but because of the blown gasket. just because it looks fine doesn't mean it is. if a girl on here can do it, why can't you? hehe a piston not traveling all the way up would affect compression wouldn't it? I know that a simple visual check isn't good enough, but I would expect a fair ammount of visible damage to at least one valve considering how far down that piston is. as for the energy, I mentioned earlier that I have a large budget. That is due largely to substantial ammounts of overtime. also I have a wife and kid I would like to spend SOME time with. hehe. there isn't really any place in my town to take a head to for inspection either. I would really like to give it an all out effort, but considering how much I paid for it, and how much I could sell it for, it would be incredibly easier and more cost effective to get another one. I am also in the process of restoring my 68 bug. I only have 2 hands, and it is a hard decision every time I walk in my garage to pick which one to work on. hehe. indigent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slick Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 (edited) if a girl on here can do it, why can't you? hehe awwwww........ nowz ya gots me all flushed mz... lol. but yeah, he's right, i did it, and it's not that hard..... with crap compression, the truck won't run it's best anyway.... this is what found on my #4 piston (the HG actually blew near #2 piston tho) it doesn't look like yours is THAT bad, but it sure ain't right..... if you have the finances to fix it now, then go for it. Here's the write up of when i built me a new one after my HG blew.... and no, my truck barely smoked at start-up . and i drover her 3 months that way until i had the $$ for another motor (i'm like that.. me likey to build things) Here's the linky http://www.nissanpathfinders.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=4410&hl= and http://www.nissanpathfinders.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=7404&hl= oh, and I have XE's & SE Pathy's......... i love my XE (mini me) best if knobs n switches are whatcha want. get a mercedez. you only travel 20 miles a day...... i travel 50.... and i still prefer to drive my 5 spd XE i have had more trouble with the rear disk on king (my SE) than with mini's drums. unless you plan on slamming on your brakes at every light or towing a heavy load... ya really don't need em. shock control.. most folks don't want to pay double for the special shocks they take.... and never use it....... Edited February 19, 2008 by Slick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigent Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 (edited) oh, and I have XE's & SE Pathy's......... i love my XE (mini me) best if knobs n switches are whatcha want. get a mercedez. you only travel 20 miles a day...... i travel 50.... and i still prefer to drive my 5 spd XE i have had more trouble with the rear disk on king (my SE) than with mini's drums. unless you plan on slamming on your brakes at every light or towing a heavy load... ya really don't need em. shock control.. most folks don't want to pay double for the special shocks they take.... and never use it....... I mainly miss all of the featurs my TD27T had. I frequently tow large loads up into the mountains here. I.E. my boat or camping trailer, so those rear disc brakes really make a difference. Those adjustable shocks come in really handy when towing in the hills on the pass corners. I am not a knob and switch freak, but I do miss my headlight misters, adjustable shocks and my clinometer cluster. Although they aren't really THAT important, but they sure were nice. hehe. I *normally* only travel ~20 miles a day, but I do travel across the mountains to Seattle alot when I have time off. Is it possible to get at that piston without removing the engine? Indigent. Edited February 19, 2008 by Indigent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mws Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 I would consider this time to consider a UJM swap... Be DONE with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Question - are you Steel or Aluminum pistons? If aluminum, the ethelyn glycol (sp?) in the coolant could possibly damage the top of the piston... though I doubt it's the case here. Anyone able to confirm this? Trying to think back to my old chem classes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 a piston not traveling all the way up would affect compression wouldn't it? right but the blown gasket will show up more then the piston not getting to the top like it's supposed to. awwwww........ nowz ya gots me all flushed mz... lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indigent Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 Question - are you Steel or Aluminum pistons? If aluminum, the ethelyn glycol (sp?) in the coolant could possibly damage the top of the piston... though I doubt it's the case here. Anyone able to confirm this? Trying to think back to my old chem classes I honestly have no idea. I assume they are the original pistons. I don't know the history of this engine though. What I don't get is, why just that piston? I know for a fact that the head gasket was bad because when I pulled of the LH head the outboard side of the gasket was covered in oil, and 2,4, and 6 were all covered in nasty crap (worse that 1,3,5.) Oil has been leaking out of that side of the engine since I got it too. I would assume some damage would have occured to #4 as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zonianbrat Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 I think you have to make the decision of how long you want to keep the truck. If you like the truck and plan on keeping it for years and years then you might as well just swap the motor and keep your current motor and fix it when you have time and that way you could have the truck forever. But if you have any doubts about keeping the truck for a long time. Then I would just fix your head gasket and drive her until she goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 ^^^ that seems most sensible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey.T Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 JDM Swap or maybe ask, I know several people that have responded to you that have an extra Pistion/connecting rod laying around... Jdm motor will run you from 400 to 900. Cheap compared to say blowing a motor 10 miles from home after you have done all this work and then having to swap the motors.... ***looks around, oh that was me because i did not change a $30 t-belt when it was suggested... Bet I could pull my motor in less than 2 hours alone, and that includes cleaning out the garage.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slick Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Bet I could pull my motor in less than 2 hours alone, and that includes cleaning out the garage.... we're kinda pros by now huh thomas? lmao. can't decide whether that's a good or bad thing..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuong Nguyen Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 I practiced a lot as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yozsi Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Question - are you Steel or Aluminum pistons? If aluminum, the ethelyn glycol (sp?) in the coolant could possibly damage the top of the piston... though I doubt it's the case here. Anyone able to confirm this? Trying to think back to my old chem classes lol... steel pistons? thats a new one.... ethylene glycol bad for aluminum? you kidding? the cylinder heads, water pump, radiator, intake manifold, etc are all aluminum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kittamaru Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 yozsi, I believe the older pathy's used steel pistons and heads, though I could easily be wrong. I forget when aluminum became the easier to use metal and the more readily available one *shrugs* I know engines used to be primarily steel though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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