BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 Sup guys. Got a 88 pathy se. straight axled dana 44's. got 190,000 on the clock. It hasnt been drivin much in the past couple of years. finally got around to redoing my suspension. i would always start it up atleast once a week to the keep the fluids flowing. about 2 weeks ago it got very cold here for a few days. before it got cold, i started it up like usual ran fine. after the cold spell, i went to crank it again and it started, but ideled very rough. it was like it was overloading. it would clear out when you reved it up, but would cut out again and idle low and rough when dropped back to idle. the gas should have been pretty fresh. i put some sea foam in the tank with some 93 and made no difference. the next day i went to try it again and it would not start at all. it would try to hit about every 3 or 4 rotations. so i then put a bottle of heet in the tank in case there was any condensation in the system. also changed the fuel filter. while i had the filter off, i hit the ignition a few times to make sure the fuel pump was working like it should. and it was. still wont start. any ideas?? Thanks in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 (edited) Hi, What you just described sounds so similar to the problem I had with my 89. I'm guessing here, but I'll bet you fouled the plugs while it was rough idling? Have you pulled a wire to check spark, or pulled the cap to check th rotor and cap for moisture? When you do get it running, try putting some Techron fuel system cleaner in the fuel tank, and then drive it around for a few days to soften up the carbon deposits on the valves and intake ports etc... From what i read in an old TSB. These engines were notorious for carbon build up and deposits. The TSB recommended media blasting the intake runners and valves, with walnut shells to clean off the carbon deposits. (I'm guessing walnut shells can be easily 'digested' by the engine) since t it didn't say anything about removing the heads. After running the fuel system cleaner, pull the plugs and replace them. After I pulled my hair out, and finally doing this, my truck went back to idling like it should and the fuel mileage,power improved. BTW, you shouldn't need to add 'heet' to your fuel, as theres already ethanol alcohol in the fuel from the pump. Let me know if this helps. krmiller07 Edited December 27, 2010 by krmiller07 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 27, 2010 Author Share Posted December 27, 2010 Thanks for the info bud. I did pull the cap and there was no moisture. I havnt checked for spark. It is just weird how it happened. It ran fine one day. Then it got really cold for about 2 or 3 days. Then it started running bad. When i first fired it back up after the cold weather, it was smoking a little. It was a white smoke. Definately a gas smoke. I had guy from another nissan forum tell me to try a bottle of heet because at the time, it had less than a 1/8 tank. Could the fuel regulator or maybe the injectors be going bad? Thanks for any info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 Thanks for the info bud. I did pull the cap and there was no moisture. I haven't checked for spark. It is just weird how it happened. It ran fine one day. Then it got really cold for about 2 or 3 days. Then it started running bad. When i first fired it back up after the cold weather, it was smoking a little. It was a white smoke. Definitely a gas smoke. I had guy from another Nissan forum tell me to try a bottle of heet because at the time, it had less than a 1/8 tank. Could the fuel regulator or maybe the injectors be going bad? Thanks for any info If you live in AL, chances are it hasn't gotten below freezing correct? That white smoke your describing. Does it hang in the air? Or is it just vapor coming out your exhaust pipe? If it's hanging in the air, more than likely, it's burning antifreeze. Which means you've got a coolant leak somewhere, either a head gasket or possibly a cracked block or cylinder head. If theres coolant leaking down into the combustion chamber or into your cylinder heads, it has probably fouled the spark plugs. Like I mentioned before, I'd pull the plugs and see what condition they're in? As far as the injectors. I would refer back to the fuel system cleaner, as it will also clean any injectors that are not closing all the way, and causing the truck to run rich. You can also test the fuel pressure regulator with a fuel pressure gauge. The factory setting should be 36.2 lbs psi. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 28, 2010 Author Share Posted December 28, 2010 If you live in AL, chances are it hasn't gotten below freezing correct? That white smoke your describing. Does it hang in the air? Or is it just vapor coming out your exhaust pipe? If it's hanging in the air, more than likely, it's burning antifreeze. Which means you've got a coolant leak somewhere, either a head gasket or possibly a cracked block or cylinder head. If theres coolant leaking down into the combustion chamber or into your cylinder heads, it has probably fouled the spark plugs. Like I mentioned before, I'd pull the plugs and see what condition they're in? As far as the injectors. I would refer back to the fuel system cleaner, as it will also clean any injectors that are not closing all the way, and causing the truck to run rich. You can also test the fuel pressure regulator with a fuel pressure gauge. The factory setting should be 36.2 lbs psi. Hope this helps. Oh yea it has gotten below freezing. The time frame i was talking about, the temp was in the teens at night and 20's during the day. This was for about 3 days. We just had 5 inches of snow christmas morning. as for the smoke, i guess it kinda hangs in the air briefly. But i have been checking the coolant and it has not used any. i will definately pull the plugs and see what they look like. would it be a good idea to drain the tank now that i have over half a tank of 93 with seafoam and a bottle of heet? or will that not matter? now that i think about it, seems like for the past year roughly, when i start it up it seemed to be running a little rich. you can smell the hint of gas in the exhaust. dont know if this might just be from sitting for so long and just beeing started and not drivin for an extended period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 28, 2010 Share Posted December 28, 2010 Oh yea it has gotten below freezing. The time frame i was talking about, the temp was in the teens at night and 20's during the day. This was for about 3 days. We just had 5 inches of snow christmas morning. as for the smoke, i guess it kinda hangs in the air briefly. But i have been checking the coolant and it has not used any. i will definately pull the plugs and see what they look like. would it be a good idea to drain the tank now that i have over half a tank of 93 with seafoam and a bottle of heet? or will that not matter? now that i think about it, seems like for the past year roughly, when i start it up it seemed to be running a little rich. you can smell the hint of gas in the exhaust. dont know if this might just be from sitting for so long and just beeing started and not drivin for an extended period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 28, 2010 Share Posted December 28, 2010 I would leave the fuel you have in it. I would add the Techron, which is made by Chevron. Its available a most of the larger auto supply stores. As for it running rich, thats exactly what mine did. It's caused by all the carbon build up on the valves. This stuff acts like a charcoal briquette and absorbs fuel like a sponge. it literally drips off of the deposits and into the combustion chamber in the form of raw fuel. KM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 28, 2010 Author Share Posted December 28, 2010 I would leave the fuel you have in it. I would add the Techron, which is made by Chevron. Its available a most of the larger auto supply stores. As for it running rich, thats exactly what mine did. It's caused by all the carbon build up on the valves. This stuff acts like a charcoal briquette and absorbs fuel like a sponge. it literally drips off of the deposits and into the combustion chamber in the form of raw fuel. KM I will definately try that. Thanks for all the help buddy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 30, 2010 Author Share Posted December 30, 2010 (edited) I will definately try that. Thanks for all the help buddy! Well it finally started. Smoked like hell probably due to all the fuel additives. Seemed to run good. Then it bogged down again and shut off. Tried to start it back up and it didn't even act like it wanted to. It looked like it had blown gas out of the exhaust on to the ground. Then I noticed a big spot of oil on the ground under the motor. Appeared to be very thin and kinda watery. I noticed it looked like it was leaking around the front side part of the oil pan. And from the front main seal a little. But the spot on the grond looked like it sprayed out from somewhere. Sounds and looks like bad news guys . Thoughts?? Edited December 30, 2010 by BIGFINDERMAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 Well it finally started. Smoked like hell probably due to all the fuel additives. Seemed to run good. Then it bogged down again and shut off. Tried to start it back up and it didn't even act like it wanted to. It looked like it had blown gas out of the exhaust on to the ground. Then I noticed a big spot of oil on the ground under the motor. Appeared to be very thin and kinda watery. I noticed it looked like it was leaking around the front side part of the oil pan. And from the front main seal a little. But the spot on the grond looked like it sprayed out from somewhere. Sounds and looks like bad news guys . Thoughts?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 (edited) Have you looked in the radiator! If the color of the coolant looks like chocolate milk, you've probably got a coolant leak. I'd also pull out the dip stick and take a look at the color of your oil as well.Smell it too. It is possible the crank case is full of either fuel,coolant..or both. Pull all the plugs out and crank over the engine to blow all of what might be in there, out. If it was dumping fuel down the intake from an injector being stuck open or coolant leaking in. You can Hydro lock the engine and bend rods, valves and blow out crank shaft seals in extreme circumstances. PULL THE PLUGS FIRST! Edited December 30, 2010 by krmiller07 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 30, 2010 Author Share Posted December 30, 2010 Have you looked in the radiator! If the color of the coolant looks like chocolate milk, you've probably got a coolant leak. I'd also pull out the dip stick and take a look at the color of your oil as well.Smell it too. It is possible the crank case is full of either fuel,coolant..or both. Pull all the plugs out and crank over the engine to blow all of what might be in there, out. If it was dumping fuel down the intake from an injector being stuck open or coolant leaking in. You can Hydro lock the engine and bend rods, valves and blow out crank shaft seals in extreme circumstances. PULL THE PLUGS FIRST! I did look in the radiator. Still full and green like it should be. I will check the dipstick and pull the plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 30, 2010 Author Share Posted December 30, 2010 I did look in the radiator. Still full and green like it should be. I will check the dipstick and pull the plugs. Pulled the dipstick and it smells like a mixture of oil and gas. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 Pulled the dipstick and it smells like a mixture of oil and gas. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 Drain the oil and refill. Put new plugs in it and try restarting the beast. Keep the idle up, until it gets up to temp and try driving it. If it wants to run, take it out on the freeway or an open road and run the snot out of it. Give the additives in the tank a chance to work. Then just see what happens. Once the fuel cleaner starts breaking down rhe carbon deposits it may run a little rough, but try burning as much of the fuel in the tank down until it's almost empty and refill it. It should run better on the second tank full. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 31, 2010 Author Share Posted December 31, 2010 Drain the oil and refill. Put new plugs in it and try restarting the beast. Keep the idle up, until it gets up to temp and try driving it. If it wants to run, take it out on the freeway or an open road and run the snot out of it. Give the additives in the tank a chance to work. Then just see what happens. Once the fuel cleaner starts breaking down rhe carbon deposits it may run a little rough, but try burning as much of the fuel in the tank down until it's almost empty and refill it. It should run better on the second tank full. Just drained my oil and it was full of gas. Poored out like water. What would cause that much gas to get in the oil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted December 31, 2010 Share Posted December 31, 2010 A stuck/dirty injector and or a faulty fuel pressure regulator!If you have a fuel pressure gauge, hook it up. it should read approx 36 lbs. Also turn the key on (to accessory), and listen for the fuel pump, it should run (or hum) until it's up to pressure and then shut off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted December 31, 2010 Author Share Posted December 31, 2010 A stuck/dirty injector and or a faulty fuel pressure regulator!If you have a fuel pressure gauge, hook it up. it should read approx 36 lbs. Also turn the key on (to accessory), and listen for the fuel pump, it should run (or hum) until it's up to pressure and then shut off. I know the fuel pump is workn properly. I don't have a gauge. I will have to borrow one. Can u manually clean the injectors somehow? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted January 1, 2011 Share Posted January 1, 2011 I know the fuel pump is working properly. I don't have a gauge. I will have to borrow one. Can u manually clean the injectors somehow? Thanks No, you can't manually clean the injectors. What your trying to check with the fuel pump is actually checking to see if the fuel pressure regulator is working properly. If the pump were to continue to run, then the pressure regulator would allow pressure to continue to push fuel into and past the injectors. (if one of the two injectors is dirty) This will flood the engine or cause it to run rich. If the pump runs for a few seconds and stops. Then theres adequate pressure, the regulator is regulating and hopefully the injectors are closing when the motor isn't running. If you don;t have one, I'd highly suggest buying a Clymer or Haynes manual for your truck! It'll help you diagnose most of the problems you could have, or at least point you in the right direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 No, you can't manually clean the injectors. What your trying to check with the fuel pump is actually checking to see if the fuel pressure regulator is working properly. If the pump were to continue to run, then the pressure regulator would allow pressure to continue to push fuel into and past the injectors. (if one of the two injectors is dirty) This will flood the engine or cause it to run rich. If the pump runs for a few seconds and stops. Then theres adequate pressure, the regulator is regulating and hopefully the injectors are closing when the motor isn't running. If you don;t have one, I'd highly suggest buying a Clymer or Haynes manual for your truck! It'll help you diagnose most of the problems you could have, or at least point you in the right direction. Changed the oil and put new plugs in her today. She started right up. It seemed to run pretty good. I kept it revd up a little till it got up to runnin temp. It idled a little rough, prolly due to all the fuel additives. I havnt checked the fuel pressure yet, but will as soon as I can get a gauge. Maybe everything will be straight with her now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Changed the oil and put new plugs in her today. She started right up. It seemed to run pretty good. I kept it revd up a little till it got up to running temp. It idled a little rough, prolly due to all the fuel additives. I haven't checked the fuel pressure yet, but will as soon as I can get a gauge. Maybe everything will be straight with her now. It will run rough and probably crappy! Until the fuel in the tank has run through the system and cleans out all THE CARBON AND OTHER DEPOSITS. Then fill it up with a fresh tank from as close to empty as possible. Try running the Techron additive though once every 3 months just to keep it cleaned out. Worked for me and saved me a bunch of money on having unnecessary repair work done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 It will run rough and probably crappy! Until the fuel in the tank has run through the system and cleans out all THE CARBON AND OTHER DEPOSITS. Then fill it up with a fresh tank from as close to empty as possible. Try running the Techron additive though once every 3 months just to keep it cleaned out. Worked for me and saved me a bunch of money on having unnecessary repair work done. Yea I will definately run some of that techron in it once in a while. I really just need to get it out and drive the crap out of it. But I still have to put shocks on it and finish up some welding before I can do that. I really appreciate all the help buddy! Thanks for ur time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGFINDERMAN Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 Yea I will definately run some of that techron in it once in a while. I really just need to get it out and drive the crap out of it. But I still have to put shocks on it and finish up some welding before I can do that. I really appreciate all the help buddy! Thanks for ur time. Well i have been cranking it everyday and letting it run for a while. It is running good besides idling a little rough. I have noticed that my front and rear main seals appear to be leaking a little. I know this has just recently started. Could the thinning of the oil due to all the gas that got in the bottom end be to blame for this? Thanks again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krmiller07 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Well i have been cranking it everyday and letting it run for a while. It is running good besides idling a little rough. I have noticed that my front and rear main seals appear to be leaking a little. I know this has just recently started. Could the thinning of the oil due to all the gas that got in the bottom end be to blame for this? Thanks again yes it could. And the seals may have shrunk a little do to setting idle for awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamzan Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Put some lucas oil additive in it next time you change the oil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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