No Start/Click Fix

[RedPath88]

But here's what I did on my 87:

Just had to do this on my truck, it started the single click/no start thing yesterday and quickly got worse.

 

Simple to do, although I went about it a little differently, the end result is the same. But most important, every test start has proven successful

[ahardb0dy]

My 94 is doing the same exact thing, although I just had a JDM engine put in so no idea what year it actually is, I have a brand new battery all the connections are tight, when I changed my oil for the first time I knocked 2 wires off, one was for the oil pressure sender and the other went to the starter solenoid, The starter solenoid wire someone cut the factory plug off and put a crimp on connector on it but I crimped the end a little to make it have a tighter connection, also tye wrapped it to a wire near the fender opening in case it comes undone again it will be easier to get to.

 

Question is, by adding the new relay the way it has been described here previously, doesn't the starter already use a relay from the factory?

 

this is the starter diagram I just took out of the 94 FSM, where does the new relay get spliced in on here? thanks

 

[RedPath88]

The new relay is placed at the 87M/22E connection point.

 

By eliminating a portion of the original degrading wire, and running power directly from the batteryonly using the short section of existing wire from connector 22E through 24E and to the solenoid, there is less resistance. This results in more power being delivered to the starter solenoid and allows it to engage properly.

 

 

 

If your talking about the Interlock Relay (Connectors 52M on EL80-81 of the '94 FSM) then that is still used for the interlock circuit. But what formally sent power all the way to the solenoid, now just trips the new relay. The new relay sends power to the solenoid now, directly from the battery

[ahardb0dy]

what gauge wire do you recommend to tie into the wire going to the solenoid? 10 gauge big enough? guess it doesn't pay to use a larger gauge than what the factory used right?

 

so as was posted previously about checking the interlock relay, if the interlock relay is going bad or acting screwy, than adding the new relay won't help as the trigger wire for the new relay comes off the output of the interlock relay correct?

 

Will wire that up tomorrow, thanks will post results

Edited May 30, 2010 by ahardb0dy

[ahardb0dy]

I did the relay for the starter as specified, so far started truck about 10 times and started every time !! I didn't route or secure the wires yet wanted to see if it would work first, I didn't cut the wire going to the starter solenoid, I just extended it and ran it to the relay, than from the relay I ran a new 10 Gauge wire to the solenoid, what rating fuse would you recommend on the wire from the battery to the relay? I used 10 gauge for this wire and did not want to splice in a fuse holder with smaller gauge wire so for right now I ran it with no fuse, I know not good but wanted to see if it would work, pic below where I put the relay:

 

blue is going to starter solenoid wire, yellow to solenoid and red to battery, black looped to relay screw is the ground

 

[RedPath88]

Ok so much for that idea fixing it, it started again

Edited May 31, 2010 by RedPath88

[RedPath88]

The click is now coming from the solenoid itself, but only seem to have the problem (at this point) when the engine/bay is hot. So it must be heat related. Likely a sign that the starter/solenoid assembly is failing.

 

But since it tests "good" on the bench at the store, it cannot be replaced under warranty yet

 

 

Anyone know any good ways to stress a failing starter?

 

Also, has anyone ever used a starter blanket (heat shielding) before? Results?

 

http://www.designengineering.com/category/catalog/design-engineering-inc/component-specific-products/versa-shield

 

EDIT:

So it is in fact exhibiting "Heat Soak" symptoms now, going to try the blanket and see if that helps. If not, well the starter is covered under a forever warranty so...

Edited May 31, 2010 by RedPath88

[ahardb0dy]

if the starter works in the store, when it's cold I presume, can you possibly have them test it while it's hot? Maybe heat it up before you bring it in to them? Your starter has to be on it's way out if it doesn't start when it's hot as I have never heard of heat soak effecting the Nissan starters, usually those heat blankets are for Chevy's.

 

also if it is the solenoid you can just replace that although you probably have to pull the whole starter to replace the solenoid and may just want to replace the whole thing if you have to pull it for the solenoid.

 

I would explain it to the guy/gal in the store, that it doesn't start when it's hot, if the starter is still in the truck maybe get it hot under normal operating conditions and have the guy come out to see that it doesn't start when it's hot, just an idea.

[RedPath88]

if the starter works in the store, when it's cold I presume, can you possibly have them test it while it's hot? Maybe heat it up before you bring it in to them? Your starter has to be on it's way out if it doesn't start when it's hot as I have never heard of heat soak effecting the Nissan starters, usually those heat blankets are for Chevy's.

 

also if it is the solenoid you can just replace that although you probably have to pull the whole starter to replace the solenoid and may just want to replace the whole thing if you have to pull it for the solenoid.

 

I would explain it to the guy/gal in the store, that it doesn't start when it's hot, if the starter is still in the truck maybe get it hot under normal operating conditions and have the guy come out to see that it doesn't start when it's hot, just an idea.

 

 

Trust me, I tired. Apparently O'reilly is enforcing new rules on Schucks stores now, they have some new machine that can print results and they have to include those will all warranty replacements now... and they have a new manager there to "make sure" the new rules are followed *loves corp America*

Before now I never had a problem with them honoring a warranty simply by my word. Well other than when Schucks first bought out Al's Auto Supply, they tried much the same that O'reilly is now, but that did not last long.

 

Yes the solenoid is replaceable, but the entire assembly is under a Forever/Lifetime Warranty, so I'll just wait till it dies or see if I can kill it sooner.

 

Oh and yeah, first start after putting it back in (with the blanket installed) it friggin clicked. And has several times during test starting. So obviously it is getting worse, hopefully it dies at a convenient time and location

 

Before taking it out of the truck, I even ran a new test lead (brand new wire) directly from the Battery to the connectors and I got a click 2-3 times out of about 10. But on their machine, they did five tests and it passed all five

 

 

 

 

I did think about something else, a side-benefit if yo will about the blanket. I have an oil relo, so it's a non-issue for me now, but for those who do not, an installed heat wrap/blanket will help keep some oil out of the starter during oil changes

[RedPath88]

Did you read the prior posts? I already did that... and I did it without cutting anything

 

 

The test lead I ran was just to eliminate everything except the starter/soleniod itself. It was nothing more than a jumper to directly power the solenoid/starter, before pulling it and heading down to the parts store for testing. Did not even require the key to be turned

[ahardb0dy]

sorry I replied to what I thought was the last post about what wires to cut, than realized it was a post from the first page so I deleted my post, guess you replied to the post I deleted

[RedPath88]

lol Ok at first I was but that makes more sense!

[ahardb0dy]

I saw there was a new post so I clicked on the thread, saw the post I was going to reply too, replied it was posted than saw the previous one wasn't what I thought I had just replied too, was almost falling a sleep, than found the other post on page one so I deleted my reply, than saw you replied, bed time I guess have to get up early junkyard again tomorrow WOO HOO !!! LOl

[RedPath88]

Ok so after a run around at one store (different from the one noted above) a third one exchanged the starter for me. Installed and tested, 15 successful cranks out of 15 attempts.

 

I'll give this a week or two before I convert back to stock circuit layout (remove the relay) and see if that mod was needed (in my case) in the first place

[ahardb0dy]

mine is still starting fine, it actually sounds like it is cranking faster,on a related note I drove my 90 sentra to the junkyard, when I went to leave it would just click (5 speed manual), I rocked it back and forth slightly and it started right up, stopped at the auto parts and supermarket and both times same thing just would click, when I got home and finished with the PF I took the starter out of the sentra, cleaned it up a little, wire brushed the contacts where the wires go, than took the solenoid off, and cleaned that all up, put it back together and back in the car and tried starting it and all it would do is spin !! I was like oh crap, so took it back out and removed the solenoid and discovered I had the spring inside on wrong, fixed that put it back in the car and it started right up, will see what happens tomorrow after work.

 

The starter may be the original one (in the sentra), it has an orange label on it that says Nissan with the part number, if it is original it's not bad 20 years old and all!! I keep telling my wife the starter is the only thing that I haven't replaced on the car yet, LOL

Edited June 2, 2010 by ahardb0dy

[ahardb0dy]

not PF related but update on cleaning the starter solenoid in my 90 Sentra, so far since I took it apart, the car has started every time the first time, hopefully what ever I did will last for a while.

[ahardb0dy]

Did the starter relay mod May 30th and it is still starting strong, hopefully it will continue to do so, Sentra is also still starting since I took the solenoid apart and cleaned it !!

[jfypaths]

The biggest PITA with the headers and a 5-speed is getting at the top starter bolt. I had to bend up a 14mm box end wrench in order to turn it. Even then I could only turn it 1/8 turn before repositioning the wrench to get another bite at it.

Dammit man! There's just no room!

Gently tap a long fat screw driver between the bell housing & the header it will give you inuff clearance to fit in your socket without having to take off your headers. It would be nice if they came already pretended for such things as the oil filter and that damn bolt! just my 3cents.

[dmag23]

I am just getting over a nasty bout of the Norovirus (love traveling)... But I am back in the world of the living again. I still need some assistance too with locating the "wire under the battery" that when ran through a relay is supposed to cure the starter issues with the Pathfinders. Maybe someone has a photo they can share. The article that was sent to me was very good, but I am still having trouble isolating the specific wire in question.

 

 

 

 

 

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That would be good. My Pathy is down at the moment unless I push start it. I would be happy to drive to you if you can point out the wire that needs to be altered. Thanks for the offer...

[ahardb0dy]

Did the starter relay mod May 30th and it is still starting strong, hopefully it will continue to do so, Sentra is also still starting since I took the solenoid apart and cleaned it !!

 

 

still going strong, no problems!! both vehicles !!

[dmag23]

I've been fighting the starter/click problem for a long time now. Over time, I replaced the inhibitor relay, battery, battery cables, starter, traced all the wires to check for bad connections. The last item I replaced was the ignition switch. Not the key/tumbler mechanism, just the electrical side of the switch. It went from the typical "click" issue to nothing. No click, no start, no nothing. All the other electricals were working as normal. So I removed the new ignition switch and checked with a multi-meter. It was working properly. Turns out the alignment of the switch into the key/tumbler mechanism was not right. The switch has a register mark that fits into a groove in the key tumbler mechanism. The switch is then secured in place with a single screw. I left the screw a little loose when I reinstalled the switch, allowing me to rotate the switch ever so slightly. That "ever so slightly" is what made the difference between getting nothing when I turned the key to start, and getting a click when I turned the key, and finally having the starter turn over likes it is supposed to. So the problem I had all along was................even though the key was rotated into the start position, the ignition switch contacts weren't fully engaged because it wasn't aligned properly. I modified (via drill bit) the ignition switch and key/tumbler mechanism to allow me to rotate/re-position the ignition switch so that when the ignition key was fully rotated into the start position, I got good engagement of the ignition switch contacts. I haven't had a problem since.

 

Try it yourself. Pull off the upper and lower steering column covers, exposing the electrical side of the ignition switch. Find the securing screw at the bottom of the ignition switch. Loosen it or take it out completely. With the key rotated into the start position, rotate the electrical side of the ignition switch as it sits in the key/tumbler mechanism. I would go from starting to clicking to nothing with very little rotation of the electrical switch. When I say very little rotation, I mean 1 or 2 degrees of rotation (if not fractions of a degree). For kicks, I did the same thing with my old ignition switch. Same results. It wasn't the switch (or any other component for that matter) causing the "click" issue, just the switch alignment.

[JamesRich]

I just did the relay mod and it took care of my problem!

I got this truck in January and slowly modded it for hunting. Yesterday, one day before I leave for it's first official hunting trip, It wouldn't start! Little Bastard! About 15 minutes for this mod and it cranks every time.

I tested for voltage while doing the mod. First off the ground for the inhibitor relay has .3 ohms resistance. The battery had 12.63 volts but the inhibitor relay only sent 12.05 to the starter and this was with no load on it. It's all good now thanks to this forum!

I think I will look into the problem dmag23 had too.

James

[synthetic]

had the same issue, easy way i found out it was in the column was to jump the column to the up position and try and start. worked every time for me. dmag, thanks for the actual how-to.