kcpath Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Rebuilt 92 v6 Pathy engine....it was a challenging and fun project. I was excited to get it all back together and hear it come back to life, but no such luck. Everything powers up, it turns over, but won't start. Everything was running before I started the rebuild. I rebuilt it because I had the time off work and the money, plus it was leaking oil and was just sluggish, 220K Here is what I have tried: New plugs, dist. cap and rotor...all plugs spark. The fuel pressure is fine. I can hear the injectors clicking while turning the distributor by hand. The timing is close to perfect...until I get it to fire that is the only way to tell. ECM lights come on like there supposed to. I've tried adjusting the distributor timing several ways. I'm looking for things to test and try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowTied Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 How did you install the distributor? It can be easy to accidently put it in 180 degrees out of phase on some engines... I don't know the VGs very well though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 How did you install the distributor? It can be easy to accidently put it in 180 degrees out of phase on some engines... I don't know the VGs very well though. The rotor should point to the No. 1 cylinder while its set at TDC. I followed the directions in the FSM and also cross-referenced the Chilton manual. I also tried making adjustments to it to see if I could get it to fire in any position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PATHRIDER Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 (edited) crank the pulley again by hand to a full turn and line up your rotor..it took me 4 tries to do my dizzy..when i tried to line up my motor to cyl 1 i was actually lining up the rotor to spark plug 1 on the motor instead of the dizzy cap...lol..Thanks to nunya for correcting me on that..When I lined it up the third time it was like at 10 o clock Kc im kinda lost on these The fuel pressure is fine. I can hear the injectors clicking while turning the distributor by hand. The timing is close to perfect...until I get it to fire that is the only way to tell. how did you turn the distributor and made the injectors click? I did my fuel pressure check the ancient way by disconnecting the hose going in the fuel filter and out Howd you get the timing set if its not running? Edited March 8, 2010 by PATHRIDER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 (edited) crank the pulley again by hand to a full turn and line up your rotor..it took me 4 tries to do my dizzy..when i tried to line up my motor to cyl 1 i was actually lining up the rotor to spark plug 1 on the motor instead of the dizzy cap...lol..Thanks to nunya for correcting me on that..When I lined it up the third time it was like at 10 o clock Kc im kinda lost on these The fuel pressure is fine. I can hear the injectors clicking while turning the distributor by hand. The timing is close to perfect...until I get it to fire that is the only way to tell. how did you turn the distributor and made the injectors click? I did my fuel pressure check the ancient way by disconnecting the hose going in the fuel filter and out Howd you get the timing set if its not running? I actually had a bad fuel hose and gas was squirting out everywhere...kinda lead me to believe the pressure is good The injector tests are in the FSM. Pull the dist. out of the head and turn the key to ON, then rotate the dist clockwise...you'll hear the fuel pump pumping fuel and each injector will click. Leave the dist. plugged in of course. I meant the belts and dist are as perfect as I can get them until I hear run. I don't understand your explanation of lining up the rotor except 10 o'clock. Can you pls explain? Thanks for the help. I was reading some of the electrical FSM and I think I have a blown fusible link near the battery. I remember when I was taking it apart and the pos cable touched the neg post. Also the connector on the cable is melted/broken/corroded. I try bypassing in tomorrow to test. I look forward to hearing more about lining the rotor. Thanks pal! Edited March 8, 2010 by kcpath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 (edited) Do you have the 1 cylinder on the exhaust stroke instead of on the compressing stroke,that will cause it to not fire. Edited March 8, 2010 by nismothunder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PATHRIDER Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 I actually had a bad fuel hose and gas was squirting out everywhere...kinda lead me to believe the pressure is good The injector tests are in the FSM. Pull the dist. out of the head and turn the key to ON, then rotate the dist clockwise...you'll hear the fuel pump pumping fuel and each injector will click. Leave the dist. plugged in of course. I meant the belts and dist are as perfect as I can get them until I hear run. I don't understand your explanation of lining up the rotor except 10 o'clock. Can you pls explain? Thanks for the help. I was reading some of the electrical FSM and I think I have a blown fusible link near the battery. I remember when I was taking it apart and the pos cable touched the neg post. Also the connector on the cable is melted/broken/corroded. I try bypassing in tomorrow to test. I look forward to hearing more about lining the rotor. Thanks pal! Im sure you can get it running and probably some little things that you just overlooked out of excitement..when I did my dizzy I forgot to take the breaker bar off my pulley when I was cranking it by hand and started it...lol..On the rotor lining it with spark plug 1, If you look at it straight down like looking at a clock itll be at 10 o clock...the rotor will be like the small hand on the clock..Just like when we do our timing the tensioners allen hole is at 5 o clock thats how we determine we have the proper tension on the belt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 Im sure you can get it running and probably some little things that you just overlooked out of excitement..when I did my dizzy I forgot to take the breaker bar off my pulley when I was cranking it by hand and started it...lol..On the rotor lining it with spark plug 1, If you look at it straight down like looking at a clock itll be at 10 o clock...the rotor will be like the small hand on the clock..Just like when we do our timing the tensioners allen hole is at 5 o clock thats how we determine we have the proper tension on the belt I know...something little...damn the little things. I'll go see if I can realign the rotor. I bypassed the fusible links...still no luck. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 is the rotor position really that picky? I figured if it was off a tooth or so then it would still fire but run like @!*%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 Still nothing ya'll. I'ved tried the dist in many positions. This thing will just not start...ahhh I need it to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jj big shoe Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 My swap was a problem as well. I didn't have my vacuum lines run correctly. Once I figured that out, it still wouldn't start since I fouled the plugs trying to fire it w/ bad vac lines. Completely frustrating I know, but you'll get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PATHRIDER Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 wish I could be of more help KC...somebody on here would probably give you some other tip on how to get it running bud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 9, 2010 Author Share Posted March 9, 2010 wish I could be of more help KC...somebody on here would probably give you some other tip on how to get it running bud Its like getting your favorite toy when you where a kid and it breaks. My neighbor is a master mechanic...he bleeds oil basically, so he said if its timed right and all the obvious has been checked then its the ECM. I'm going to jack with the dist. more and replace the plugs tomorrow. The ECM was working the same day I pulled the engine out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 Did you check to see if the 1 cylinder is on the compression or exhaust stroke,if its on the exhaust it wont fire because all the fuel is get pushed out of the intake into the exhaust.I check it by putting your fingure over the spark plug hole to see if you feel your fingure getting pushed back by the pressure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PATHRIDER Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 (edited) Worth trying a different ecm or ecu .This thread will be a learning experience for me another thing that puzzles me is the test on the injectors This is what you said :The injector tests are in the FSM. Pull the dist. out of the head and turn the key to ON, then rotate the dist clockwise...you'll hear the fuel pump pumping fuel and each injector will click. Leave the dist. plugged in of course. How does rotating the distributor while its pulled off of the head and rotating it clockwise while the key is on make the injectors click? not trying to confuse you myself or the others but it just doesnt make any sense Edited March 9, 2010 by PATHRIDER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 9, 2010 Author Share Posted March 9, 2010 Worth trying a different ecm or ecu .This thread will be a learning experience for me another thing that puzzles me is the test on the injectors This is what you said :The injector tests are in the FSM. Pull the dist. out of the head and turn the key to ON, then rotate the dist clockwise...you'll hear the fuel pump pumping fuel and each injector will click. Leave the dist. plugged in of course. How does rotating the distributor while its pulled off of the head and rotating it clockwise while the key is on make the injectors click? not trying to confuse you myself or the others but it just doesnt make any sense actually its counter clockwise. How? I don;'t know something to do with the electronics. I also confirmed it was on the compression stroke and to make sure I tried the exhaust stroke just to try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Have you tryed shooting some starting fluid in it to get it to fire.Most new engines/rebuilt/engine that have sat need the extra help the first time starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowTied Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 I am sure by now you doubled checked the firing order already, the coil is properly wired, ground wires/straps are in place and you have tested for spark and fuel by the proper procedures in a repair manual. Perhaps the little zap you had at the battery did fry the ECU....? I hate when that happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 I think it would be unlikely to fry the computer over zapping the battery... I know I've done it on accident countless times, both on this truck and my old one, and it hasn't harmed anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 what I've tried so far... Put new plugs in it today to make sure the old (new ones) where not fouled. Adjusted the dist timing several ways, the Chilton manual says put the rotor at 11 o'clock, but have tried 10 o'clock all while No 1 is at TDC. I've adjusted it to the compression stroke and the exhaust stroke just to make sure. All plugs spark Fusible links are good Confirmed ground is good ECM lights are ok Will try some spraying the intake tomorrow with starter fluid. Thanks ya'll and keep the suggestions comging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nismothunder Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Just wondering aloud hear but what did you do to rebuild the engine.Did you re ring it too or just replace all the other stuff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 (edited) Just wondering aloud hear but what did you do to rebuild the engine.Did you re ring it too or just replace all the other stuff? Tore it down to the bear block...new pistons, rings, oil pump, bearings, valve job, new timing belt, water pump, new headers, etc....it was a complete rebuild, the block, heads, valve covers, oil pan where all media blasted and the block was bored, crank grind, and the heads where decked...should be like a brand new engine. Edited March 10, 2010 by kcpath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcpath Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 ok...a little something new. sprayed starter fluid in the intake and it started, but dies. I adjusted the dist more and kept trying the started fluid...will start, but dies. humm... now what guys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KovemaN Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Sounds like fuel delivery. Pump, relay or fuse could be culprits. Can you hear the pump running when you turn the key on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowTied Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Agreed with Kove.... you could even have fuel, but not enough pressure.... I have only installed distributors on carb'd engines, so that manual "at 11o;clock" thing seems weird to me. If cylinder #1 is at TDC on the compression stroke, then the rotor should point just a few degrees before the number on wire on the cap - regardless of anything else.... If it was running for a a few seconds on the starter fluid then it is more likely a fuel issue, just saying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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