edta1 Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Hi, I have 2k1 Pathfinder with almost 50K on it. When I brake at high speeds (not slamming, just trying to slow down), my car starts jerking forward a bit. Not a lot so that the person jumps but enough to feel the jerk. The higher the speeds from which I start braking the worse the jerk feels. On casual city driving, I can barely feel it. Not sure if it is related, but also at high speeds, the steering wheel seems to sway a bit much. I'm about to take my car to the dealer for an oil change soon and would like them to take a look at the problem. But before I do that I would like to find out if this can be a do-it-yourself job. The front brake pads were replaced at about 30-35K. :help: Question 2, how do I know if it is time to replace my shocks? The shocks are stock and came with the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93blkpathr Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Sounds like a loose brake component - settling in quickly as you apply the brakes and causing a jerk when things reach a resting point. Only other thing I can think of is a warped rotor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transworldmoto Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Being a mechanic, this problem is so common it's a wonder the person who invented rotors never thought of it. To me, it sounds like a warped rotor, which I seriously suggest checking out, otherise your gonna pay a bundle for a new set. Well, you could get some cheap crappy ones, but I don't suggest that. Ask your mechanic to measure the "thickness" of the rotors at four spots, opposite each other. If one spot is more than 10,000ths of an inch off, it's warped. I've dealt witht these alot, and in about 10 mins, your local auto shop can grind em down to like new conditions. Oh, and make sure you change your pads frequently. That helps to keep the heat off the rotor so much. OH, and I suggest GreenStuff brake pads. They're awsome! Good Luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 imbalanced tires will do that too. worn idler arm may show similar symptoms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 measure the "thickness" of the rotors at four spots, opposite each other. If one spot is more than 10,000ths of an inch off, it's warped. I've dealt witht these alot, and in about 10 mins, your local auto shop can grind em down to like new conditions. Transworldmoto, are you serious ? You are telling me that if one's rotor is .0001" higher or lower in any of 4 opposing spots it's warped ? First off, that measures out of parallel, not warp. By your definition ALL rotors come warped from the factory ! .0001" is 1/40TH the width of a hair.... You measure the rotor 'warp' (run out) with an indicator while spinning the mounted rotor and the manual states factory spec for a 90-95 at .0028 max allowable, and that is a very tight spec. I'm certain that the brakes on an 01 have not been upgraded to the level you imply. All the shops I've been in turn the rotors true, not grind, although that would be preferable if they kept the rotors cool enough not to re-warp them. Not trying to flame you, but you are so far off the mark it is hard not to be critical, and people can be misled. edta1- First have the brakes bled by someone who knows the proper routine, then, assuming the brake pads, etc are in good shape, I would consider caliper problems. If they check out ok, then it may be a front end component. FYI, warped rotors will make the brake petal pulse and or the steering wheel shudder a little when the brakes are applied. Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 man, i don't even remember when i turned any of the rotors on any of amy vehicles.. if you get a vibration then definately otherwise don't waste your time.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 11, 2004 Author Share Posted December 11, 2004 Ok, I spoke with a mechanic briefly and he suggested I have my rotors shaved (same as turning?). Is there a way a home mechanic can do this himself? Or do you need big specialized tools to do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 Yes, it is the same as turning (putting it on a lathe) but it's kinda funny he calls it shaving, like you have hairy rotors or something.... Yes, most 'complete' shops will have a machine for turning durms and rotors, or they will oursource it. Either way, it's no big deal. While turning the rotors usually doesn't hurt, I still question if this is the issue. I'm morally opposed to paying for work that doesn't directly address the issue. But then again, I haven't inspected the brake system or driven the car so I'm not going to cry foul too loud... Good luck, and keep us informed please. Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 11, 2004 Author Share Posted December 11, 2004 What do you mean "...doesn't directly address the issue"? So is there a way for average joe to turn his rotors at home? With sand paper and a brillow pad maybe? Or does this have to be done with a machine shop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 What I mean is that I'm not sure that warped rotors are part of the 'jerking stop' issue you complained about, but then I have not inspected or driven you vehicle so I'm going more by hunch.... You need a lathe or brake turning machine to turn the rotors. What is done is to mount the rotors (preferably by the locating surface) on a lathe and spin it. They you drag a sharp tool across both sides, making them flat and parallel. Simple operation really, but you need a lathe and a little bit of experience... Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaritimeMan Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Basically what Bernard is saying, is that yes, you have to take it in. I'd imagine that turning a rotor in a lathe would be a most difficult task, as you would have a PITA of a time trying to get the thing to spin on its true axis. Only way I've ever seen it done is one a special rotor/ drum turning machine. Not to say its impossible, as I know better than to present that challenge to you Bernard, just difficult. M.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatterHorn Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 or you could just get new rotors ... for the piece of mind and the fact that they aren't all that expensive ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Yes, new rotors are an option IF thats the problem.... LOL MM, yes, it takes some indicating to get it right on a lathe, but it's not that bad. Personally, I'd use the old trick of mounting it on the spindle in the chuck; then it's a piece of cake Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 14, 2004 Author Share Posted December 14, 2004 Hello All, I just came back from the dealer. Here's the list of things that need to be done: Turn Rotors Replace Front brake pads repack front bearings wheel balance They want to charge me $400 to do the job. I want to do as much as I can to save $$$. I can replace the front pads no problem. I'm pretty sure I can repack the front bearings. As for the rotors, I don't know. They want to charge me $140 to turn each rotor. New ones cost about $86. So I want to just replace the rotors since it is cheaper anyways. The dealer says that even new rotors need to be turned. Is this true? Pep Boys says new rotors do not need to be turned. So who is right? I can replace the rotors, no prob. But if I have to turn them even if new...then forget it. I can get the wheel balance done free from NTB. So is the dealer right about turning new rotors? :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 14, 2004 Share Posted December 14, 2004 Ok edta1, this is what I would do (and it seems like you are up for it and it isn't that hard). Buy brake pads, remove tires, remove rotors (have to do it to repack grease anyway) and take them (tires and rotors) to a local tire/allignment shop you know/trust to have the rotors turned and wheels re-ballanced. This should be about $90 MAX, but I'm gestimating. Ok, install everything (new pads and disk brake bearing grease, get this specifically!, for another $60ish) and you have done all the work for $150 in parts/service. Now enjoy the other $250 and tell the stealership to FO !! OK, if the stealership sells Nissan rotors, and they need to be turned out of the box before installing (these being OEM parts), that means that the rotors that come equiped on NEW vehicles are out of spec and need to be turned before they leave the car lot. Doesn't that sound like BS to you ? I have never seen new rotors that say 'must be turned before installation' on the box. That would be like selling rotor blanks to be machined into required specifications. Again, BS !! That's why they are known as stealerships. You would either be amused or in horror if you were present when a service manager tried to tell me tell me that crap !! Ok, just re-read your post, and you can get ballance for free... Do it !! Just have the rotors turned, repack bearings, install new pads, bleed the brakes, and you are set !! One more time for good luck. The Dealership is full of crap about new rotors having to be turned. Don't deal with them again, or call them on their BS, it wont hold up !! Good luck and let us know how it went... Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 14, 2004 Author Share Posted December 14, 2004 Thanks for the tips and guidance, Precise. It doesn't sound as hard as the dealer made the job out to be. I'll let you know how it goes. I probably won't be able to get to it until this weekend though. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 16, 2004 Author Share Posted December 16, 2004 Ok. I'm trying to remove the disc. I took the wheel off. I took the calipers, pads and the caliper bracket off. I even removed the 6 nuts that attach the hub to the disc. But that darn disc won't come off. I mean it is as if I didn't remove anything. I looked inside out and it doesn't appear to have anything holding it in place. Am I missing something? Please help. Thanks. :help: :help: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 I have a 95, and dont have an exploded (or any) view of the hub/rotor assembly for an 01. I know they are different animals, but you will need to do something like, remove the center hub cap, drive flange ?, lock nut(s) and wheel bearings before the rotors will come off. I'm assuming you don't have a manual ? Anyone with a manual or experience with an 01 ? Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 17, 2004 Author Share Posted December 17, 2004 Hello, I figured I'd have to remove all that before. I can't get the hub off either. I took the 6 bolts holding it in place off already. But that cap is held tight. I tried taking a flathead screwdriver to see if it will come loose....nope...it wouldn't budge. Do I have to take that black center cap off? I have a manual but it doesn't mention anything about removing the hub cap etc. etc. in order to take the rotor off. It hints that once the caliper brackets come off, the hub and rotor will come off as one assembly. So I guess the manual I have is wrong. First step I guess, How do you take that hub cap off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 bfh my friend... hahahahahaha then you'll have a "washer with two phillips screws, then a nut and that's about it. when removing the locking hubs, make sure to keep the "breaks" in the same order they came out... as to turning you rotors. if you feel the need, when you have the assemblies off of the tk take them to pep boys or auto zone and have them turned. about $10 ea... repacking bearings is easy.. don't forget new seals, inner and outer for both sides... new brake hoses too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 17, 2004 Author Share Posted December 17, 2004 bfh my friend... hahahahahaha then you'll have a "washer with two phillips screws, then a nut and that's about it. when removing the locking hubs, make sure to keep the "breaks" in the same order they came out... Where do I find this washer and 2 philips screws? I looked everywhere for bolts and nuts. I really think I took every possible screw off already. Is it behind the "black cap" in the center (pardon my newb lingo but I have no idea what that thing is) of the hub? That is the only thing that I can't take off. How do I remove this? BTW - What is BFH? Thanks in advance. Yea I spoke with Pep Boys and they were going to turn my rotors for $8 a piece. AWESOME! Better than letting the dealer eat $140 per rotor. :oops: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94extreme Posted December 18, 2004 Share Posted December 18, 2004 BFH= yeh, remove the hub (center cap) and the washer w/ screws etc... are in there... i am assuming you're 4x4... the hub is retained by 6-8 7mm allen (torx) bolts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Precise1 Posted December 21, 2004 Share Posted December 21, 2004 edta1, did you ever get the rotors off ?? What was the hang up ? Sorry I wasn't able to inform you, but I am suprised no one chimed in with information... B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 21, 2004 Author Share Posted December 21, 2004 Hello Precise1, I got the rotors off (the hang-up was the center cap. I wasn't sure if I was supposed to take it off or not). I got them turned. I'm I'm putting them back on. I got the left side done, no problem. But for some reason, the right side won't go on right. When everything sits perfect, a groove is supposed to show so I can snap the snap-ring in place. Something isn't going on straight or all the way in, because I don't see that groove. *sigh* Time to take it apart again. Good thing I have air tools. Or this job can really be a pain. I'll keep you posted. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edta1 Posted December 22, 2004 Author Share Posted December 22, 2004 HURRAY!! HURRAY!! I did it! I did it! I assembled the rest together last night. Tested it and WOW! The car drive like new. Now I just have to get my wheels rebalanced and I'll be all set. Thank you Precise1 and everyone else in the forum!! Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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