Lifting 97 Pathy - Part # questions

[AlumniCU]

I'm collecting parts to rebuild the suspension of the 97 Pathy SE. It's not a daily driver but for snow and the Rockies. Here's a rundown, with questions... By biggest challenge is part numbers for rear shocks that will work with 2" AC lift, and what OEM strut mounting parts I need to order.

 

Tires, wheels and hubs -

- Tires are in good shape

- Keeping 15x7 stock Pathy SE rims for now (or could get new wheels)

- Warn Premium Manual Locking Hubs (have received)

 

Questions - I'm undecided about 31" on stock rims or going a little larger with new wheels and 32"

- Any suggestions for wheels, and what size (should I just go ahead and look at 15X8 or other size with appropriate backspacing for 32")

- Would you get 32" over 31"?

 

Front suspension -

- AC springs for 2” lift (have received)

- AC Camber Alignment Kit (have received)

- KYB GR-2 struts (will order)

- OEM strut tower mounts (will order)

 

Questions

- What specific OEM parts do I need for the strut mounts/bearings?

 

Rear suspension -

- NEED shock recommendation with part numbers - Rancho 9000XL? RSX? 5000? BILSTIEN???

- Need to fix death wobble - will get OEM replacement lower arms or AC poly bushings, bolts

 

Questions -

- 9000XL vs. RS5000 vs. RSX vs. BILSTIEN????

- WHICH PART NUMBERS WITH THE AC 2" LIFT???????????????

 

IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE I'M MISSING?

 

I'd appreciate any thoughts

 

AlumniCU

Edited August 31, 2009 by AlumniCU

[alexrex20]

i have Bilstein 7100 rear shocks. 10in total travel with 26in compressed length. that's the same total travel but with 2in longer down travel.

 

for the struts, you'll need:

 

http://www.courtesyparts.com/54320-insulat..._4800_4802&

 

http://www.courtesyparts.com/54325-bearing...4-p-203546.html

 

you will probably need:

 

http://www.courtesyparts.com/54050m-bumper..._4800_4802&

[alexrex20]

actually, this is the strut insulator you need:

 

http://www.courtesyparts.com/54320-insulat..._4800_4802&

 

i'd edit my previous post, but it seems i've lost that privilege as well, despite being told i would be given a 20min window to edit my posts. YAY!

[AlumniCU]

i have Bilstein 7100 rear shocks. 10in total travel with 26in compressed length. that's the same total travel but with 2in longer down travel.

 

Did these fit without modification? Is there a part number - the Bilstein online application docs aren't much help?

[Fukinitupagain]

Did these fit without modification? Is there a part number - the Bilstein online application docs aren't much help?

You'll be fine. The 99.5-2004 R50's have to do some modification if I'm not mistaken though.

 

Also, unless you go to a 15x8 rim I wouldn't push 32's, b/c they are all* (*at least to my knowledge) an 11.5" wide tire which would be too much for a 15x7 rim especially if you offroad & air down a bit. As stated on AC I run 15x8 black steelies (I couldn't tell you what brand as I traded my stock rims for them) with 3.75" of BS & 32x11.5x15 BFG MT's that have never let me down. Oh & the bolt pattern is 6x5.5 incase you didn't already know.

 

You can get plain black offroad rims farirly cheap, like $55 or so a rim, if I'm not mistaken. Theres a guy on pirate4x4 (HERES THE LINK TO THE THREAD) that runs killer deals on Interco's & rims for cheap (much cheaper, mounted & shipped than like Discount Tire or any other hack joint can offer), so PM him & check it out.

[AlumniCU]

Also, unless you go to a 15x8 rim I wouldn't push 32's, b/c they are all* (*at least to my knowledge) an 11.5" wide tire which would be too much for a 15x7 rim especially if you offroad & air down a bit. As stated on AC I run 15x8 black steelies (I couldn't tell you what brand as I traded my stock rims for them) with 3.75" of BS & 32x11.5x15 BFG MT's that have never let me down. Oh & the bolt pattern is 6x5.5 incase you didn't already know.

 

Yes, wouldn't try to do anything beyond 31 without new wheels with appropriate backspacing. Thanks for your responses and suggestions. Will check t out.

[AlumniCU]

Installed my Warn hubs yesterday. Have recommendations for Bilstein 7100 and Rancho RS9000 (RS99010) (do like the adjustability). Any other thoughts?

 

To drop the rear axle to get the springs on, any advice dealing with cables, brakelines and tubes? Any good strategies on how to? The front GR-2 struts will be done by a shop unless one of you in Colorado wants to play (case of beer?). Would save me money for some skid plates...

[alexrex20]

if you have an extra vehicle (or a helping friend), i would suggest you remove the strut yourself, and bring it to the shop and only have them install the spring. it will save you a lot of money, as removing/installing an assembled strut onto the vehicle is very easy.

 

the install the rear springs, all you have to do is unbolt the track bar on the axle side, unbolt the shocks on the axle side, and possibly even unbolt your rear sway bar at the end link. from here, the axle should drop enough to fully decompress the spring, so it will just drop right out. the AC coils are the same overall uncompressed length as stock, so they will go in just as easily. the brake lines and breather hose should have enough slack to remove the rear coils, but be sure to keep an eye on them anyway. only lower the axle as low as you need to remove the spring, and you should be safe.

 

i personally have Bilstein 7100s so of course that's my recommendation. everyone is going to recommend what they have, but from what i've read on the forum over the years, Ranchos tend to have more reliability issues than the other options. either they were junk from the getgo and they had trouble warrantying them, or they wore prematurely and also had warranty difficulties. i've heard lots of good things about bilsteins, whether you go with the 5125/5150 shocks or the more expensive 7100s. KYB does make rear shocks, but most people don't use them.

[180sx]

KYB does make rear shocks, but most people don't use them.

 

This is what I'm wonderign about. Everyone swears up and down that the struts are the way to go, but no one at all has said anything, not even a mention, about their rear shocks...why is that? Do they really suck that badly? Or are they pretty much just OEM style?

Sorry to kind of thread jack (or maybe not, it is on topic, right?)

 

Jose

[AlumniCU]

This is what I'm wonderign about. Everyone swears up and down that the struts are the way to go, but no one at all has said anything, not even a mention, about their rear shocks...why is that? Do they really suck that badly? Or are they pretty much just OEM style?

Sorry to kind of thread jack (or maybe not, it is on topic, right?)

 

They make one that specifically fits stock, but with the lift I suspect you need to have a longer extension?

 

My challenge is getting the exact shock part number - I believe the Rancho rs9000 is the rs99010 (thx Dean). What would in be for Bilstien or Rancho 5000? I just need to order the parts!!!

[alexrex20]

you don't necessarily need longer shocks when you install a lift.

[tekazgtr1984]

you don't necessarily need longer shocks when you install a lift.

 

Nope but it couldn't hurt.

 

If only a company out there made longer struts for the R50...

[180sx]

Nope but it couldn't hurt.

 

If only a company out there made longer struts for the R50...

 

But then a company would have to make new CV's that could handle the angle, right?

[fleurys]

But then a company would have to make new CV's that could handle the angle, right?

 

 

Not really... each time we here about cv failure, it's actually the boot that let go..not the cv itself... Unless you gun it in reverse locked while turning (sorry gpg..that one was too easy hahaha), the cv's are strong....just the boot are crap...

 

I will eventually finish rebuiding my second set with dorman boots and see how they resist...but i'm actively looking for having boot custom made with a more plastic/rubber like material...a bit like you see on a pinzgauer...

 

S

[AlumniCU]

Just ordered the Rancho RS99010 ($47.99 each - good deal). Anyone know if the the KYB GR-2 struts ship with boots?

[fleurys]

Just ordered the Rancho RS99010 ($47.99 each - good deal). Anyone know if the the KYB GR-2 struts ship with boots?

 

You got a good deal because you just ordered discontinued shocks... this part number is the old one... the nes ones are rs999010xl ....

 

You're getting shocks that have been sitting on the shelf for pretty long now.....get the new ones if it's not too late...

 

 

For the kyb, you have to get the boot separately...they don't come with it.

[AlumniCU]

You got a good deal because you just ordered discontinued shocks... this part number is the old one... the nes ones are rs999010xl ....

 

You're getting shocks that have been sitting on the shelf for pretty long now.....get the new ones if it's not too late...

For the kyb, you have to get the boot separately...they don't come with it.

 

Was aware they were replaced by the others - but would they be significantly worse than the newer ones, or are the new ones significantly better?

Edited August 3, 2009 by AlumniCU

[fleurys]

Was aware they were replaced by the others - but would they be significantly worse than the newer ones, or are the new ones significantly better?

 

good question... I guess you would have your answer if you called rancho... But at least you knew about it..So that's all I was worried about... Maybe someone who sells shocks could chime in... Would dried up oil seal be a possibility on old shocks that were sitting on a shelf for many month, say a year??

 

I like my rs999010xl very much but they are prone to more failure that I thought. When ordering I did received one that was DOA and now after a few trails, they still work flawlessly but it seems that the firmness dial is shot. I can barely turn it anymore and they are only a few months old... They have seen mud and water but I was still expecting more from them... Needless to say after they are shot, i'm switching to bilstein...

[180sx]

i have Bilstein 7100 rear shocks. 10in total travel with 26in compressed length. that's the same total travel but with 2in longer down travel.

 

How much did you get your shocks for? And where did you get them from? I know they are a bit pricey, but with a SFD 'possibly' in the works, seems best to get the good stuff now, right?

 

Jose

[alexrex20]

How much did you get your shocks for? And where did you get them from? I know they are a bit pricey, but with a SFD 'possibly' in the works, seems best to get the good stuff now, right?

 

Jose

 

 

i got them from Top Gun Customz, but i went through their eBay store for the added eBay/PayPal security. i got them for $280 plus shipping, which was the cheapest i could find them online. they have great customer service, as well.

[AlumniCU]

I should be set to install this weekend.

 

As far as tools, I have an impact wrench (for the shocks, struts and lower control arms. I have a sawzall to cut out the metal sleeves on the control arms. I have a number of jackstands and two hydraulic jacks.

 

I may get a spring compresser for the AC springs, but I worry about killing myself. Any advice on assembling the struts? What's a good price to have them assembled in a shop>

 

To press in the AC bushings into the control arms, I don't have a press. Could a large table mounted vice do the trick?

[AlumniCU]

Having my struts assembled tomorrow morning by a shop. Not to my surprise, I couldn't compress the AC springs enough to get them on the GR-2 struts. Any advice on mounting the struts once they're assembled? I suspect getting the strut bolt holes to line up is going to be difficult.

[alexrex20]

expect to pay $40-50 to have the struts assembled. i tried to DIY my AC coils, but the rental tool was a piece of crap, so i took it to my uncle's shop and used his big fancy wall-mounted spring compressor.

 

to reinstall the strut, i like to keep a floorjack under the lower control arm. you'll want it down pretty low, but be mindful of the CV boot. i get the top of the strut inside the fender near its mount holes, then attach the lower mount bolts to the spindle. it's pretty tricky and cumbersome to do by yourself, but it's possible. the floorjack comes in handy here, as you finesse the spindle into position (by raising/lowering the jack) to align the bolt holes.

 

once the bolts are in, you can align the upper mount bolts with the holes in the strut tower, then raise the jack slowly as you guide them into place.

[AlumniCU]

DONE! Pic is in my profile.

 

AC springs, KYB GR2 struts all installed in the driveway today. Waiting for the Rancho 9000 shocks to be delivered, but did get the rear springs done. Pep Boys assembled the struts (took them three times and my direct supervision to get it right - gggrrrr, but they're open Sunday. Installation job was easier than I thought - thank goodness for impact wrenches. Truck looks great. Still need to receive the poly bushings I ordered for the lower control arms.

 

Skid plates and sliders are next, and then eventually 32s on new wheels - that will wait a while.

 

Thanks to all that provided advice and counsel - it made a big difference.

 

Question - I need to get it aligned. What do I need to look out for when I get the alignment? I do have the camber bolts from AC, but they are not installed.

Edited August 10, 2009 by AlumniCU

[alexrex20]

you can only do a 2-wheel alignment - they align the front to the rear, because nothing can be adjusted on the rear. on the front, only toe is adjustable from the factory. the camber bolts allow camber adjustment; caster is not adjustable. don't let the salesman bull@!*% you about needing this or that. all your vehicle needs is a 2-wheel alignment, and you can tell them you bought camber bolts for them to use.

 

how much did they charge to assemble the struts? also, post the full-size pic of your pathy.