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Tomek

Prob w/ Bilstein 5125 33-185552 + LR 9447 Spring Mod

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Hi Guys, I dropped these in to go with my LR springs in the back last summer.

 

They fit upside down and all was good. Took the rig on Whipsaw trail etc as per my previous posts.

 

I had a clunking in the rear right for a while now which was getting worse so I got around to getting it checked out.

 

My mechanic says the (what is now) bottom bushing on the shock is blown out.  The other side seems fine.

 

When trying to warranty to shock they told him to bugger off as they are not for my '99 pathfinder.  haha

 

What are your thoughts?  Did I get the wrong shocks for the LR Spring mod?  

 

My mechanic says he's never really seem bushing blow like that and whats to know what to do.

 

Any other shock suggestions to go with the LR Spring mod, or try these again and hope it was an anomaly?

 

Much obliged,

Tom

 

 

 

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I think you can just get a replacement bushing. 

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Thanks for the quick reply mate!  Think it was just something weird / anomaly?  

 

Not the end of the world if I need diff / better shocks.

 

Maybe I'll ask if he can just do that and see if it hold?

 

Appreciate your advise!

Tom

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Never messed around with the bilsteins, but I haven’t heard of anything like that happening to anyone who used them. 
 

I run the 9447 Land Rover springs and personally use Gabriel Ultras for shocks. Haven’t had any problems since installing the last year, and the flex is still plenty good enough for me even though they are only 24.5 inches extended (I think). I’m sure the ride is not quite as nice as the bilsteins though 

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Thinking about it a little more I guess we do slightly more than "normal" off road (whatever that means lol).

Maybe they just can't take the beating.  The 5100s are low end shocks after all.

 

Perhaps I'll see if my guy can jam stronger bushings in on both sides and see how that holds.

 

Next step might be better shocks?

 

Let me know what makes and models you guys are using with the LR springs (aside from 5100s).

 

Thanks, Tom

 

 

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Got me thinking... (dangerous I know) .. 

 

Maybe the 5125 33-185552 are too short and I should should get the 5165 25-187717 to go with the 9447 springs?

 

Or even worse replace the bushings in the 33-185552 and cut the springs one inch (ducking).

(that would help with the rake I have too)

 

pathy-lift.jpg

 

 

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Sounds like an unusual issue indeed, 5100's are extremely common in the Toyota communities I'm involved in and failures are few and far between, with the only ones I've seen being the end snapping off due to extreme abuse. I wouldn't take unusual premature bushing wear as a reason to jump up in cost on shocks, although if you want longer ones anyways it's a good excuse haha. That's also extremely like Bilstein to deny warranty, from what I've seen it seems that they will only warranty things when they're done precisely as they specify, although that does make sense I suppose.

 

Personally I think the amount of rake you have is very reasonable and looks good, is the trunk empty in the pic? A couple toolboxes and/or camping gear when on trips should get it level I'd imagine, so if it sits a bit uneven day to day but sits right in the woods, sounds like a good setup to me.

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Ya the rake doesn't bother me much at all but I could go an inch lower in the back when all is loaded.

 

That would still leave me with a bit or rake which is what I like (closer to a factory 1" higher in the back).

 

Also hoping slightly shorter spring will relive pressure on the bushings when extended?

 

Going with the 5165 25-187717 I would need to extend my break lines, so kind-a don't want to go that route.

 

Appreciate the input re 5100's in general.  I wonder if some of the clunking I had in the rear end before just prematurely wore that bushing.

 

I'll see if my guy feels like jamming some new bushings in there and cutting the springs at bit.

 

Anyone know if all 5100 bushings are the same size?  Are there 3rd party poly options so I can get something stronger?

 

Links would be awesome if anyone has some for bushings!

 

Cheers guys!  

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Poly bushings to fit the bilstein shocks are definitely available 

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I have LR 9449's which are just the stiffer version of the 9447's and currently use Bilstein 33-185569. I do have the tire carrier on the back which adds some weight, but I've never had any issue with my bushings or length of stock brake lines yet.

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Good to know guys, gives me some more options.

 

Much obliged,

Cheers!

 

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@Zak  Looks like you have a post face lift.  I wonder if that's a concern with the 185569s on my pre face lift.

 

Looks like they are quite a bit larger than my 185552s..  Obviously no probs with sprigs popping out.

 

Good to know guys, gives me some more options.

 

Much obliged,

Cheers!

 

Bilstein 5125 Series Shock Absorber - 33-185569

  • Collapsed Length (in.): 17.91
  • Extended Length (in.): 29.7
  • Travel Length (in.): 11.79
  • Compression: 700
  • Rebound: 2550
  • Lower Mount: 5/8 inch Eye
  • Upper Mount: 5/8 inch Eye
  • Shaft Diameter: 14mm
  • Reservoir: No
  • Finish: Zinc Plated
  • Body Design: 46mm ID Smooth Body (Non-Coilover)
  • Internal Design: Mono tube
  • Boot Included: Yes

Bilstein 5100 Series Shock Absorber - 33-185552

  • Collapsed Length (in.): 15.91
  • Extended Length (in.): 25.93
  • Travel Length (IN): 10.02
  • Lower Mount: Eye 16mm
  • Upper Mount: Eye 16mm
  • Shaft Diameter: 14mm
  • Reservoir: No
  • Finish: Zinc Plated
  • Body Design: 46mm ID Smooth Body (Non-Coilover)
  • Internal Design: Mono tube
  • Boot Included: Yes

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Okay so update. Me and @PathyDude17 started chatting and it appears there's more differences in rear shock mount placement and required lengths than I originally thought!

 

Pre-facelift has an upper mount that is slight up/away from the top of the spring mount, and a lower mount that is about in line with the axle.

 

My 3.3L post-facelift has an upper mount like pre, but a lower mount that is dropped below the axle.

 

3.5L post-facelift seems to have an upper mount closer to the top spring mount and dropped below the axle.

 

We're going to try to gather some picture examples and put together a separate post about it. Just another example of all the minute differences between models...

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You guys are amazing!  (but you already know that haha)

 

Just got off the phone with my mechanic and we decided to replace all four bushings on my existing 185552s.

 

Thinking perhaps the clunking I had in the past just pre maturely wore that bushing out.

 

Since then I've replaced all the other suspension bushings (not noticing the damaged one on the shock as they are new shocks).

 

Now to find some poly bushings and jam them in!

 

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Posted (edited)

Not to jump the gun on the shocks and shock mount info, but one thing I already do know about the 33 185569's is that they're not suitable for pre facelift shock mounts unless you have alot of lift. I've personally had to reseat @micahfelker's 9448's (yes, NRC9448 springs with no coils cut), back after they drop out at full flex. The pre facelift shock mounts are close enough together that a 30" fully extended shock is just too long, whereas my 9449's stay seated at full flex (I have a 2003).

Edited by PathyDude17
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Posted (edited)

Roger that!   

 

Looking around for bushings apparently the 185552s Upper mount has 5/8 inch hourglass bushing.

 

Will post more specs as I find them. 

 

Edit - okay so apparently the Energy Suspension 9.8107G bushing should fit the 5100s.

 

Gonna grab them and report back how it went!

 

B000CN9D3K?tag=duc12-20&linkCode=ogi&th=B000CN9D3K?tag=duc12-20&linkCode=ogi&th=

 

Edited by Tomek
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2 hours ago, zakzackzachary said:

Okay so update. Me and @PathyDude17 started chatting and it appears there's more differences in rear shock mount placement and required lengths than I originally thought!

 

Pre-facelift has an upper mount that is slight up/away from the top of the spring mount, and a lower mount that is about in line with the axle.

 

My 3.3L post-facelift has an upper mount like pre, but a lower mount that is dropped below the axle.

 

3.5L post-facelift seems to have an upper mount closer to the top spring mount and dropped below the axle.

 

We're going to try to gather some picture examples and put together a separate post about it. Just another example of all the minute differences between models...

Excellent info here, I had no idea there were slight differences 

 

How does this affect fitment of the bilsteins? Could it possibly be the reason that his bushing went? 

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So I dropped off the bushings with my guys, and discussed maybe cutting the 9447 down.

 

My logic being that guys are using the 9449s (same length but higher tension) with 33-185569 which have 4" more length over the 33-185552!

 

4" seems like quite allot, so perhaps cutting an inch or so off the 9447 might be a more suitable height for the 33-185552s I have.

 

I know a guy or two here cut their's down and I'll have to scour the threads, but opinions and advise are encouraged!  :) hehe

 

 

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I think I’m missing the logic of cutting down the spring.... if the bushing is wearing down, then it’s probably moving excessively, ie, something’s not tight. The 26” shocks that you’re currently using have been used for years on similar levels of rear lift with no known issues. 
 

Additionally, no matter what spring you put in the rear, your suspension will still travel and move the same as it always has, thus moving your shock in the same manner as before. The problem is with the shock- it’s bushings, or how it’s been attached.

 

Just my $0.02

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Copy that makes sense!  Probably wore the bushing out when other @!*% was loose / worn.

 

Thought maybe the angle on the shock would be different with lower springs, but as you said, others have had no issues so...

 

Thanks for the $0.02 in these hard economic times hehe.  I'll just keep them how they are.

 

Cheers guys!

 

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I’d really steer clear of cutting the coils 

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I'm with ya, but just curious, any specific reason?

 

Appreciate the input still learning from you guys!

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Posted (edited)
On 4/2/2020 at 11:30 AM, PathyDude17 said:

Not to jump the gun on the shocks and shock mount info, but one thing I already do know about the 33 185569's is that they're not suitable for pre facelift shock mounts unless you have alot of lift. I've personally had to reseat @micahfelker's 9448's (yes, NRC9448 springs with no coils cut), back after they drop out at full flex. The pre facelift shock mounts are close enough together that a 30" fully extended shock is just too long, whereas my 9449's stay seated at full flex (I have a 2003).

Consider the above statement as "pending review". I just got in touch with a few other pre-facelift owners, and was informed that his rear sway bar is removed. I think I need more data before I can fully prove or disprove the assertion that the pre-facelift will function noticeably differeantly in terms of shock lengths and keeping coils seated. The shock mounts definitely do change, but its unclear what kind of precise effect this has on shock lengths and unseating coils. Just thought I'd mention that while the thread and info is still fresh.

Edited by PathyDude17
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Posted (edited)

A little late to the party... I've got a 2002 and the 33 1855569's with the NRC 9449's and mine have the tendency to fall out at full flex, just like @micahfelker. As for the strut bushings, I had that clunk for the longest time and finally got sick of it. My uppers had wore out incredibly fast, leading me to believe they didn't fit in the first place. Ended up getting polys for bottom and top (Energy Sus. 9.1808G) and lathing metal sleeves of different IDs for the upper bolt and lower stud, that fit in the bushings and around the bolt/stud.

Edited by zenopathy

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Hi Guys, thought I'd report back with our findings.   

 

We were in the process of putting the energy bushings into the bottom eye holes (of the upside down) 185552

 

and as is turns out the spacers they originally had in there were about 2mm too big on the inner diameter.

 

I guess they used whatever they could find laying around when putting the shocks in initially.

 

My thoughts are that extra 2mm allowed for too much play and banged the original Bilstein bushing down during our rough play adventures.

 

All is great now with tighter spacers and the new energy bushings.   Hope it holds, I have a hunch it will.

 

Will report back to this thread when something breaks again or in a year that it's still holding well.

 

Thanks everyone and be safe!

 

Cheers, Tom

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