Complications with getting lift

[joshrichard]

So earlier today I went into a “trusted shop” that deals with lifting trucks, bumpers, lights, etc. When I went in to ask them about lifting it they said they weren’t sure and would have to check. After checking their store catalog they said that since their manufacturers don’t carry parts and lifts for them then there must be something stopping the truck from being lifted. I explained that many people use spacers and or springs, and so I then directed him to 4wheelparts.com where it shows the AC springs and says camber bolts recommended and must have wheels with certain offset after getting them, i don’t remember the offset exactly but it says it in the description of the 2 inch springs. He then said that because it is IFS getting it aligned would be difficult and it would just eat up tires. Also, he said that there would most likely be vibration in the drive line. I get what he was saying but wouldn’t a shop like that be able to get the alignment correct??? Does anybody else have problems with vibration in the driveline??? Just want some answers from guys who have done it and experienced it, thanks.

[johann_peralta]

If they have a problem aligning it after a 2" lift (assuming its a 2"+-), they either aren't using camber bolts with enough angle adjustment, or are incompetent. That type of simple lift shouldn't create any driveline vibration. Usually it doesn't. 

[RainGoat]

I’ll let more competent mechanics handle that part but it sounds like they don’t WANT to do the work. You may need to do the lift yourself & then fight with shops to align it. I expect you can find somebody to put your strut assemblies together & then you can mount them. Spend some time trolling NPORA, you shouldn’t have trouble doing a 2” lift. I’m a former KCitian, are you in StLouis or in between? I know it can tough to find someone to do offroad modification work on your truck in that area of the country. My Mom has to essentially get it done in either CO Springs at my sisters, or out here in the NW.

[colinnwn]

Mine has had a 2 inch AC spring lift for 10 years. Never had any driveline vibration or problems with getting it aligned or poor tire wear patterns.

I do have manual front hubs, and my tires wear fast but evenly because I drive a little hard.

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[joshrichard]

I’ll let more competent mechanics handle that part but it sounds like they don’t WANT to do the work. You may need to do the lift yourself & then fight with shops to align it. I expect you can find somebody to put your strut assemblies together & then you can mount them. Spend some time trolling NPORA, you shouldn’t have trouble doing a 2” lift. I’m a former KCitian, are you in StLouis or in between? I know it can tough to find someone to do offroad modification work on your truck in that area of the country. My Mom has to essentially get it done in either CO Springs at my sisters, or out here in the NW.

The only thing that confuses me is that they have trucks in and out of that shop all day, all working with lifts and other things, I think he just knows nothing about these trucks. I actually live in Nixa, MO. About 45 mins away from Branson, and 10 mins from Springfield. We’re moving up to Kansas next year.

[joshrichard]

Mine has had a 2 inch AC spring lift for 10 years. Never had any driveline vibration or problems with getting it aligned or poor tire wear patterns.

I do have manual front hubs, and my tires wear fast but evenly because I drive a little hard.

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I’m wanting to do the AC springs in the front, do you also have problems with top out? I’m wanting to combine those with the land rover springs in the rear.

[RainGoat]

The only thing that confuses me is that they have trucks in and out of that shop all day, all working with lifts and other things, I think he just knows nothing about these trucks. I actually live in Nixa, MO. About 45 mins away from Branson, and 10 mins from Springfield. We’re moving up to Kansas next year.

I expect they’re just used to pickups.

Love the Ozarks. That unique Karst topography can’t be found anywhere else except Florida & China (I almost married a geologist once). From Johnson’s Shut-Ins in the SE to the Buffalo River just over the SW border in AK, that’s a pretty place. You’ll likely miss the land once you’re in KC.

[colinnwn]

I've only noticed it top out once. I missed that the curb started instead of a driveway, hit the curb at about 5 mph, caught a little air and heard them bang before I came down. But I wouldn't be surprised if they occasionally do top out and I don't notice.

They are a little harsh and ride rough. Nothing like any factory vehicle available in the last 30 years. If you have ever driven a IH Scout, about like that.

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[joshrichard]

I've only noticed it top out once. I missed that the curb started instead of a driveway, hit the curb at about 5 mph, caught a little air and heard them bang before I came down. But I wouldn't be surprised if they occasionally do top out and I don't notice.

They are a little harsh and ride rough. Nothing like any factory vehicle available in the last 30 years. If you have ever driven a IH Scout, about like that.

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Hmm my dad used to work for International and he said those things were super rough

[joshrichard]

I expect they’re just used to pickups.

Love the Ozarks. That unique Karst topography can’t be found anywhere else except Florida & China (I almost married a geologist once). From Johnson’s Shut-Ins in the SE to the Buffalo River just over the SW border in AK, that’s a pretty place. You’ll likely miss the land once you’re in KC.

I was in Johnson Shut-Ins over the summer, beautiful. Our family owns tons of land in Black, MO.

[XPLORx4]

If you want a lift, the easiest thing to do is to purchase new coil springs and shocks, then take them to the shop and tell them "hey, my old coil springs are sagging, and my shocks are worn out" and ask them to install these new coil springs and shocks that you got. If the front struts are still OK, you can re-use them, but if they're tired and worn, you should replace them with the springs, since the labor to replace the spring is the same as to replace the strut, too. You don't have to tell them that your new parts provide any significant lift. The shop you used simply isn't familiar with suspension lifts for MacPherson strut-based IFS.

The only thing I have run into is that some shops refuse to install customer-supplied parts due to liability/warranty-claim issues.

After the springs are installed, of course, you should get an alignment. Camber bolts (which usually correct for positive camber after lifting) may or may not be required, but the toe angle will be off.

Also, with any lift, the front CV axles will be at a higher angle and could accelerate wear on the CV boots, and may potentially introduce mild vibration of the CV joints. If you want to mitigate these issues post-lift-install, you may consider installing manually hubs on the front wheels to disengage the front drivetrain while you're not using 4WD.

Edited October 30, 2018 by XPLORx4

[RainGoat]

What’s your drivetrain? If it’s the LE multimode tx14 transmission there’s more you need to know before using manual hubs. If not, no worries.

[joshrichard]

What’s your drivetrain? If it’s the LE multimode tx14 transmission there’s more you need to know before using manual hubs. If not, no worries.

I have the tx14 and from what i’ve read the 4WD light will turn on during long trips? I understand how the hubs work and to never put it into 4WD before locking the hubs. The light doesn’t bother me because they said that it doesn’t actually affect anything. Has anything changed or is there more information known about this?

[02_Pathy]

Yeah rigs like ours are not the norms for lifting as most of them are grocery getters. I bet that shop mainly specializes in the more popular rigs out there like 4runners and jeeps. When I got my lift, I purchased all the parts for it (struts, coils and shocks) and installed most of them myself at home. I just took the struts and coils to a shop and have them assemble the unit and when I got home I just installed them on the rig. For the rear you could get by with flexing the rear axle when the frame is on jack stands and use a floor jack to lower or raise one side of the axle up or down. I also used coil compressors that I rented from an auto parts store. At the time I didn't need camber bolts for my OME lift but after I installed 1 inch spacers front and rear on top of the OME I needed them after that. I didn't get any driveline vibrations with either setup too.  As for alignments I never had an issue with it getting aligned besides the castor being out of spec slightly, but that's due to the nature of the lift. 

[scottander]

14 minutes ago, joshrichard said:

 

I have the tx14 and from what i’ve read the 4WD light will turn on during long trips? I understand how the hubs work and to never put it into 4WD before locking the hubs. The light doesn’t bother me because they said that it doesn’t actually affect anything. Has anything changed or is there more information known about this?

 

 

Not necessarily, it has for some people. I have the tx14 and have been running manual hubs for a year and the light has never come on. Only important thing is to keep it out of auto.

 

 

[RainGoat]

 

I have the tx14 and from what i’ve read the 4WD light will turn on during long trips? I understand how the hubs work and to never put it into 4WD before locking the hubs. The light doesn’t bother me because they said that it doesn’t actually affect anything. Has anything changed or is there more information known about this?

Yep, you can’t put in AWD either. ONLY 2WD with the hubs unlocked. Much more of an issue with the tx14 if anybody else were to get in your car while the hubs are unlocked.

[AlabamaDan]

I would love to lift my QX4 a few inches an put some 35s on it.  It would make so much more capable off road and look great.  But it seems like there are so many things to consider.  A 2" lift seems to start with 2 new struts, 2 new shocks, and 4 new springs.  Then there things that have to be adjusted right, camber bolts.  Do you have to extend the steering shaft?  What about brake lines?  How about that brake sensor on the rear axle?  I keep reading about possible issues with CV axle angles too.

 

I know many (most) of y'all have lifted your R50.  What are the side effects?

[mjotrainbrain]

1 minute ago, AlabamaDan said:

I would love to lift my QX4 a few inches an put some 35s on it.  It would make so much more capable off road and look great.  But it seems like there are so many things to consider.  A 2" lift seems to start with 2 new struts, 2 new shocks, and 4 new springs.  Then there things that have to be adjusted right, camber bolts.  Do you have to extend the steering shaft?  What about brake lines?  How about that brake sensor on the rear axle?  I keep reading about possible issues with CV axle angles too.

 

I know many (most) of y'all have lifted your R50.  What are the side effects?

 

First of all, you'll have to cut pretty much everything to make 35's fit with a 2" lift.

 

Now, as far as mods needed got a 2" lift, all you have to worry about is the camber bolts.  The rest isn't needed until you go higher.  Steering shaft only needs extending when you do an SFD, brake lines and brake sensor should be ok (although brake lines are easy enough to replace with OEM parts from other Nissans; @hawairish knows the details for that) unless you go 3 inches or more, and CV angle will only be an issue with over 2" of lift with spacers at full droop.  With a spring lift like you seemed to suggest you're planning to get, you shouldn't have any issues with CV binding since the suspension still has the exact same range of travel as before, it's just that the CV will be at a higher angle more often so it'll wear out quicker than normal; they should still last a good long time, but for under $200 you can put your mind at ease and reap some other benefits with some manual hubs.

[AlabamaDan]

2 hours ago, mjotrainbrain said:

 

First of all, you'll have to cut pretty much everything to make 35's fit with a 2" lift.

 

 

Okay.  33s?

[AlabamaDan]

2 hours ago, mjotrainbrain said:

Now, as far as mods needed got a 2" lift, all you have to worry about is the camber bolts.  The rest isn't needed until you go higher.  Steering shaft only needs extending when you do an SFD, brake lines and brake sensor should be ok (although brake lines are easy enough to replace with OEM parts from other Nissans; @hawairish knows the details for that) unless you go 3 inches or more, and CV angle will only be an issue with over 2" of lift with spacers at full droop.  With a spring lift like you seemed to suggest you're planning to get, you shouldn't have any issues with CV binding since the suspension still has the exact same range of travel as before, it's just that the CV will be at a higher angle more often so it'll wear out quicker than normal; they should still last a good long time, but for under $200 you can put your mind at ease and reap some other benefits with some manual hubs.

 

So basically, there are no significant issues with a 2" lift?

Edited November 6, 2018 by AlabamaDan

[joshrichard]

3 minutes ago, AlabamaDan said:

 

Okay.  33s?

 

[mjotrainbrain]

51 minutes ago, AlabamaDan said:

 

Okay.  33s?

 

That is certainly doable, but I'm not sure on exactly what you'll have to do; I did 32's with a custom bumper so I don't know the details for running 33's.  All I know is if you want to run bigger than 31" you'll need to either get wheels with less backspacing (shoot for 3.75") or get some wheel spacers.

[mjotrainbrain]

51 minutes ago, AlabamaDan said:

 

So basically, there are no significant issues with a 2" lift?

 

Pretty much nope.  Other than coils and new shocks/struts all around and then an alignment with camber bolts, you should be good to go!

[AlabamaDan]

1 hour ago, joshrichard said:

 

 

Those are awful close.  Maybe 32s are big enough...  Thanks for sharing the video.

[joshrichard]

1 minute ago, AlabamaDan said:

 

Those are awful close.  Maybe 32s are big enough...  Thanks for sharing the video.

Yeah... I went with 260/70/17 which if I remember correctly is the equivalent 31.6 and a two inch lift with some manual hubs