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R50 Tire Carrier Mod: Let's settle this!


hawairish
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So am I reading this correctly, and that the only attachment points are the 4 blind nuts on the outside sheet metal? If so, and that actually holds, this project may be simple enough for me to attack as well.

 

Thanks,

 

It looks like 4 top, 4 bottom--so 8 bolts total.

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Ok sweet thanks. Do you feel it will be strong enough to take the occasional "oops there is a tree back there" treatment that I tend to subject my truck to? My concern is causing damage to the body if/when I accidentally back into a tree, or slam down on a rock(less likely due to location, but still possible I suppose).

 

Thanks Again,

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^^ Sounds like you need a backup camera, Nova!

 

Patrick, this is awesome that you finally decided to just guinea pig this! Glad to hear this appears to support the weight without any reinforcement. I had been thinking about this for a bit and thought that some sort of exterior reinforcement might work too. Basically a base plate on the outside to distribute the weight over a wider surface and not focus it so much to the bolts on the 2 mounts. Not as OEM as you typically like your stuff, but just an idea.

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Haha, a backup camera may work, but chances are I wouldn't be looking at it when it happens anyways. I only tend to bump into things when wheeling. Many of the trails are pretty tight in the mid-atlantic. I have figured out that our rigs have a tighter turning radius than a JKU though, so that is a solid win!

 

I agree, very nice job Patrick. Hopefully my questions did not take away from the fact I think this is awesome!

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Ok sweet thanks. Do you feel it will be strong enough to take the occasional "oops there is a tree back there" treatment that I tend to subject my truck to? My concern is causing damage to the body if/when I accidentally back into a tree, or slam down on a rock(less likely due to location, but still possible I suppose).

 

Thanks Again,

 

Sounds like you need a better bumper!

 

I guess the best way to answer that question is this:

  1. If you hit something with the tire, the damage will likely be no different than if your truck originally came with a carrier. Most of the force would be on the latch and bumpstop, and the metal where that is mounted probably isn't reinforced on any R50.
  2. If you hit something with the carrier frame, it might translate into a little more damage at the mounts because there's no reinforcement to keep it from caving in...but really, I'm not sure how you'd ever really be able to know.

^^ Sounds like you need a backup camera, Nova!

 

Patrick, this is awesome that you finally decided to just guinea pig this! Glad to hear this appears to support the weight without any reinforcement. I had been thinking about this for a bit and thought that some sort of exterior reinforcement might work too. Basically a base plate on the outside to distribute the weight over a wider surface and not focus it so much to the bolts on the 2 mounts. Not as OEM as you typically like your stuff, but just an idea.

 

Ha, it took me 30 minutes just to be sure about drilling that first hole. How's it go? Measure 50 times, cut once?

 

I had thought about the exterior reinforcement option too...would be neat to have some diamond plate or something. But then you still need to think about how to attach it to the panel to keep that weight distributed. Jeeps have those as options, but those really seem like decoration pieces, and water collectors (or, rust covers!).

 

What I can tell you is that it is really solid. I cut the lip where the tire mounts, and it sits flush now. And then, I hung on it once more for 3 seconds, with tire mounted and carrier fully open. So we're talking about 300 lbs. When it closes, it feels solid. The entire truck vibrates, more like grunts. It reminds me of how solid the rear gate on my Jeep sounded when it closed.

 

Got some more pics I'll post later. Right now I've got all the latching hardware in place. I need to cut some slots in the bumper cover, and put everything back together.

 

The only other snag now is that the screws that hold the release handle in place come in contact with the finisher panel above the license plate. It can be latched, but if it's closed hard enough, it's a problem (I nicked the paint on a soft close on accident). Surely not a problem on pre-facelift models mainly because the rear hatch is different.

 

The door switch harness is also different. I haven't seen a Nissan switch that looks like it fits there, and the Nissan part number says the switch I've got is the one. Of course, I have a solution for that already.

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Awesome...just found a hidden gem. In another post, Kyle thought that maybe the metal above the bumper was dimpled or had existing holes for the hardware. This didn't end up being the case unfortunately. But, I'm just about to cut the bumper, and on the back side of it is a light outline of the parts to be cut out.

 

The reason it's awesome is because I made a template using SketchUp to pinpoint all the bolt locations, but also the areas to cut. My assumption when sketching that is that all the hardware lined up, but when I drilled earlier, it didn't seem to be the case so I was a little worried. Well, looking at the bumper, they aren't lined up, so the way I mounted them is actually spot on.

 

Still wished they would've just put the damn bolt holes, though :/.

 

Back to it...

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Well, I'm essentially done. The results are great...but I don't have any final pics to show for it...was too dark out.

 

I still need to tackle some trivial stuff like the door switch, a replacement pin to keep it open, and license plate mounting. For the last one, I think I'm going to go with an OEM one. Ain't cheap ($150+) but this carrier is pretty much permanent and this will just plug into the OE wiring. I've got the plate cable tied to the frame for now. I could easily keep it mounted there and run an LED license plate lamp off the low-level brake lamp, but I'd like to keep the space on the frame free for a future project...like a Hi-Lift. A guy nearby is selling a brand new 48" and a bunch of unused accessories for a good deal...how timely!

 

And you guys might get a kick out of this...I was looking for a new set of 5 wheel locks, but couldn't find any. I currently have a set of 4 and would've preferred to have a single key, but I stumbled across this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DP53IWY. It got bad reviews because Jeep owners apparently don't know that they don't have M12 x 1.25 wheel studs. I can only imagine that the other person who gave it 5 stars is a Jeep owner who just impacted it on and said, "Yep, perfect fit!" If you see a 5-star review from Paco, it's very possible that I wrote it. But, I bought it, and it works (not surprisingly), in case you need a locking option. Though, the carrier actually has a provision for a padlock, that would work perfect with steelies.

 

I've already pulled the underbody tire mount...man there's a lot of space under there. On-board air has been in the back of my mind, and it's a perfect space for a tank. I may also go with the Airlft bags, too...I've still got a little rake, but moving the tire further back and the weight of the carrier (it ain't light!) caused a somewhat noticeable drop.

 

Anyway, pics tomorrow!

Edited by hawairish
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Is the wire for the swing away there? I feel like I remember you said it was and even the light in the dash was too?

 

Looks good. You repainted it right? I think I might paint mine, por-15, dries reply smooth and it flipping bullet proof, hmmm giving me ideas. Lol

 

-Kyle

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Is the wire for the swing away there? I feel like I remember you said it was and even the light in the dash was too?

 

Looks good. You repainted it right? I think I might paint mine, por-15, dries reply smooth and it flipping bullet proof, hmmm giving me ideas. Lol

 

-Kyle

 

Yep, harness is there and dash light works. The pic with two harnesses...the left is the switch I pulled from the donor, but the right is the pigtail on the truck. I'm trying to figure out when the switch changed. I have the part number, but if the pics I'm seeing for it are of the actual part, there's no way it fits the harness.

 

I had it powder coated along with the sliders. Doesn't seem to be as durable as I'd expect, but I'm not terribly concerned. It's a truck. It will get used like one.

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It's just a switch right? Positive pole and negative pole? Just find a pigtail for the older style you have solder it in place. Can probably find a bunch of the older pathfinders at local yards. Boom! Lol

 

And your powder coating makes me want to por my swing away even more. That stuff is really tough!

 

-Kyle

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I thought about it, just didn't want to make the trip or deal with what's required just to get the donor vehicle's hatch opened. But, I could also use another wiring harness from it. I'll probably just solder it up directly and be done with it.

 

I've never gotten anything powder coated, so I didn't have any real expectations. The guy who did them is trying to get his foot in the door, so I gave him a shot. I think they could've turned out better, sure, but both carriers, two SFD sets, and my sliders in 3 different coats for $250. And he ground out the hinge pins and sandblasted everything. The result is fine for my needs and will last a while. And when it's time to refresh things, I'll probably do it again.

 

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Looks really good man! Glad this has finally been settled!! Kudos! Now I'll be itching to scavenge junkyards for one lol. Although I'll stick with modifying my hitch carrier for now. Will tilt the spare on an angle for better weight distribution and move the Jerries to each side of the tire.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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That's awesome! So just to reassure myself, you didn't add any reinforcement and it doesn't seem to waiver at all while open, with the tire plus your weight? I didn't think it would require much if any reinforcement, as it is very secure when closed, which is a majority of the time. Looks like I'll be swiping the carrier (and all associated bits) off my 96 before I sell it.

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That's awesome! So just to reassure myself, you didn't add any reinforcement and it doesn't seem to waiver at all while open, with the tire plus your weight? I didn't think it would require much if any reinforcement, as it is very secure when closed, which is a majority of the time. Looks like I'll be swiping the carrier (and all associated bits) off my 96 before I sell it.

 

So this is where I say something absurd like, "do at your own risk" and "may the force be with you". It'd also be foolish to not think that the factory reinforcement is there for a reason.

 

But yes, I did not add any reinforcement. I attempted to get proof tonight of its strength, but let me tell you how difficult it is to get a selfie hanging/standing on a tire carrier. If you want pics of my feet on it, then I have that shot. Also, the tire carrier itself weighs somewhere around 50-60 lbs., so I can say that it'll definitely support over 350 lbs when open.

 

If I have any concerns, it'd be the carrier opening up too quickly and the inertia causing the lower hinge bracket to torque and indent the quarter panel. The upper hinge bracket has nothing that stops the carrier when opening, only the lower bracket does. But, the area where the lower bracket mount is also probably the most structurally-sound area of the quarter panel, simply because of the shape.

 

Additionally, my hinge pin setup allows me to put additional tension on the hinges, so it takes more effort to open it and close it. I'm toying with the idea of putting a lift gate strut between the upper mount and carrier to control the motion and act as an limiter on the upper mount.

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Patrick,

That turned out excellent my friend. I think if you fashion a gas shock to soften the opening especially on an incline/side angle, you will have a fool proof setup there. Great Job!

 

Thanks for documenting this, I will be on the lookout for a spare from a junkyard now as well!

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Thanks guys, glad you like it.

 

Also, I have a few other suggestions for those considering the project:

  1. I bought an Astro Pneumatic 1427 blind nut tool (~$40). You can make a basic tool using simple parts and set them manually, but it's a more work and may produce inconsistent results. And you'll be doing a few of them. I have a few other projects that I can use the 1427 for, and it's worked well for me already (also used it on the motor mounts and skid spacer for my SFD). It has mandrels for M6, M8, M10, and M12 coarse thread blind nuts. You can obviously go the Standard route; hardware is cheaper and easier to find. But, I'm a metric guy when I have the choice.
  2. Don't buy from Fastenal. Those guys suck. They couldn't even get an order for 10mm washers right, and they kept sending me the wrong blind nuts. Couldn't tell you why I didn't go through McMaster-Carr first.
  3. The blind nuts are a little hard to find locally, at least in my case. I went to several local hardware stores, and only one even stocked any blind nuts, but they were too small or stocked in very low quantities. McM-C has them (they're listed as rivet nuts, btw); you'll want 95105A199 (M10) and 95105A191 (M8). These are zinc-plated steel with a low grip-range and large flange...be sure to get these features. These need a 13.5mm or 17/32" drill bit.
  4. I had the advantage of being able to remove the lower hinge bracket for mocking up placement and punching marks. Since the hinge brackets don't normally come off, you'll need help holding the carrier in place. To lighten the load a little, I'd remove the part that actually holds the wheel from the carrier's frame. Plan on punching then drilling 1-2 holes first, then mocking up placement again, then punching and drilling 1-2 more holes, then mocking up placement again...until all holes are drilled. The hinge brackets have wiggle room, but if some of your holes aren't exactly where you want them, you'll consume that wiggle room quickly. I recommended starting with the outer holes on the lower mount. Also, I'd complete the holes for the lower mount first...that way you can have it support the carrier for finishing the upper holes. Be mindful of keeping it level when it's in the closed position before drilling too many holes.
  5. For cutting the bumper, I have a wannabe Dremel and hand wand. I used painters tape to set lines, and cut-off wheels specifically for plastics to make quick work of things. A utility knife is good for getting the corners, then a flat file to clean things up.

Any other questions, feel free to ask. I thought about doing a build thread, but I think this content is best kept here so people are aware of the OE reinforcement.

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I was at a local junk yard and I saw one on a pathfinder. The only draw back was it was missing the latch brackets on the bumper. I think I'll go back and pick it up on my lunch break this week. I've been following this build. I'm very thankful for the wright up.

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The only draw back was it was missing the latch brackets on the bumper.

 

So, be real cautious about pulling anything that might be missing parts. I'd look up prices and availability before pulling anything, otherwise your search will continue elsewhere and cost more. Some new parts cost more than what you'll pay for the entire carrier! Parts for the newer carrier seem to be far more expensive, too. I had to buy a new latch assembly for one, but that was surprisingly only $20. The plastic hinge covers are $150/ea! :lmao:

 

The bolts that hold the latches can be reused with the blind nuts I referenced; the 10mm that hold the hinge bracket have a finer pitch than what I could find, though, so I didn't re-use those. But, I kept them anyway.

 

Also, in addition to the carrier, I'd suggest pulling the license plate offset bracket and wiring if you have the same R50 generation (pre- vs facelift). The tire will obviously block the entire license plate and lighting. I think I mentioned it earlier, but they have license plate LED bars...you could tap into the low-level brake lamp lead behind the taillight and not have to drill any holes...there's clearance along the taillight housing and you can just run it up the carrier frame wherever you mount the license plate.

 

On a side note...if you don't plan on using the OE license plate holder and wiring, I'd be very interested in paying to have it pulled for me if it's from a newer R50...the lift gates are slightly different on older models, btw, and different from QX4. The raised metal pattern appears to be the only difference. Though I don't think the QX4 ever had the option.

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Wrapped this up last night. I had gotten the switch hooked up the other week, but hadn't put a light on the license plate.

 

I ended up just splicing a weatherproof harness I had lying around from another project into the OE wiring.

 

IMG_3604.jpg

 

I kept the stock harness just in case. Kinda had to bastardize the switch to expose the leads. There must be some intermediate harness there, because I still have yet to see a switch match that plug.

 

The dash light:

 

IMG_3605.jpg

 

Guess I could've gotten in closer, but it's the VW beetle with a very large donut on the left.

 

I used a rubber well nut for the switch. Similar in function to a blind nut, just not permanent. You put a screw into it (it has a threaded insert) and it compresses the rubber around the hole and holds securely. I'm waiting for a boot to put on the switch.

 

IMG_3606.jpg

 

For license plate mounting, I ended up going with one of these: http://www.amazon.com/Trailer-License-Plate-Bracket-Snowmobile/dp/B006SIRYGG. Puts out a good amount of bright white LED light. I had been looking at some 12 LED thingy, but just seemed like it was way more lighting than I cared for, and the wire leads were reportedly very thin gauge. In retrospect, it might have been easy to work with, but just seemed too cheap for me. I picked up some vinyl coated loop clamps (1-5/8") for attaching to the frame.

 

IMG_3631.jpg

 

The license plate holder has 4 holes; two for mounting it to something, and two for mounting the license plate to it. I wanted to use the first 2 holes, but there wasn't a good location that allowed me to mount it without pinning the wires exiting the housing, blocking the taillight with the plate, or drilling into the carrier (not ready to do that yet). So I just bolted it up where I had the plate originally. I thought about mounting it sideways, but not sure I care to find out if it's legal or not. Besides, I'll probably end up moving it.

 

For wiring, the LED has a black and white lead. Black is 12V, white is ground (makes sense, right?). Also, the FSM is worthless here because the colors in its wiring diagram are for the wiring before the taillight harness (the one the bulbs actually plug into), and they change at the harness (but it doesn't reflect that). I spliced into the wiring for the taillight/stop lamp bulb (note that this one bulb is really on two circuits...you're tapping into the taillight circuit, the one that comes on with parking lamps or headlamps, not the stop lamp circuit that lights up when the brake is pressed). I drew 12V from the green/white wire, ground from the black wire, and left the green/yellow wire alone (sorry no pics).

 

I just heat-shrank the exposed wire ends, put a loom on, and elec-taped everything. There's enough gap for the wire to protrude above the taillight housing without pinching the wires (i.e., no drill), but it does hold them firmly.

Edited by hawairish
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