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4x4 parts rear swaybar disconnects


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I took this project out again today and se it on my counter, but that is about as far as I got with it. I think I lucked out as my 180* disconnects are like your one good one.

 

I've got an offroad event planned for the end of June that I will probably just take the rear one off for, but after it is off I can mock up the replacement pieces and figure out how to make at least the rear work. My issue with the pin type ones shown is noise, they are going to create quite the racket with two moveable pins, and 2 moveable clips all banging around on every bump.

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Hmm, I still need to return my 180s. Fingers crossed.

I made a list of the hardware I'll need, short of anything for related to the retaining component of all this. This has been on the back burner for me, too...big drivetrain upgrade in progress.

 

On a side note, I was trying to gauge the amount of rotation that two of the 90s will allow for the front disconnect. Because the link is attached to the strut, it rotates a little as the strut pivots. Doesn't seem like the joints allow nearly enough movement as advertised. Thoughts?

 

And agreed, those pin types would be way too loose I'm sure.

Edited by hawairish
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To be honest I totally forgot about that(in regard to attaching to the strut. The only way I can think to verify is to turn the wheel all the way to one side, and try to eyeball if the new joint will have that much rotation. This would also remove a heim style joint from a possibility up front as well.

 

If only I had thought of this sooner I could have investigated it when I was doing my brakes this morning(upgraded to hawk LTS, HUGE difference especially when combined with finally adjusting my LSV after the lift).

 

I'm going to remove the rear sway for the trip in a couple weekends, and get the rear sorted and fabbed up. I may just leave the front the heck alone until I'm able to turn this truck into a camping/wheeling only rig(probably a year or more away).

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  • 4 weeks later...

So, a little update... :angry:

 

At this point, I've done about nothing with this project except buy more parts. Can't move forward because MCP has no f*ing clue what they're doing.

 

I returned those inferior joints weeks ago and still haven't seen replacements. I kept all the other parts in hopes of keeping this alive when the replacements came, but just today when I asked for another status, they said they'd have to issue a refund for those. At this point, they'll need to plan on issuing a full refund for everything.

 

For anyone considering this project, don't deal with Midwest Control Products or Steinjager. Quality control sucks, parts availability sucks, order handling sucks (prices were good though!). These guys are losers in my book.

 

My local TrueValue has spherical links. I might go in that direction, but for now, this project is on the back burner.

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  • 1 year later...

One year later, here we are again. A few months ago, I had a pucker moment on the freeway that gave me enough reason to just put my sway bar back on (I've had it off for a several months now). I swerved away from a vehicle that was coming into my lane hard and was oblivious that I was already there...swerved, then counter-swerved...I'm lucky I didn't take out another nearby car. I'm confident my sway bar would've made that a safer experience.

 

I've been sitting on these crappy Steinjäger/MCP joints ever since. Their customer service is the suck, and I flat out got tired of dealing with their people, emails, and BS. I'm not fond of the joints (see my posts above, plus a couple more here). But in reality, since I wanted to put my sway bar back on, all I really need wre just some slightly longer end links. Seeing as I had all the materials already, I gave things a shot today.

 

IMG_4282.jpg

 

180° joints on the stock hangers. The studs on the joints are 1/2", and because the hanger seats rubber bushings on the OE end link, the hole is actually larger than 1/2", which means no drilling. However, the hanger also has cupped mounts (the top is cupped, and the bottom has an integrated cupped washer), so I used 1/2" thick washers on both sides to create flat surfaces, which I used serrated flange nuts with.

 

IMG_4283.jpg

 

The sway bar ends fit 10mm studs, so they were drilled out to 1/2" and the 90° joints secured with a nylock nut. The flange nut had too wide of a diameter to be useful here.

 

IMG_4284.jpg

 

The detachable link is just threaded run and flange nuts. One obvious flaw with the joints here is that they have no way to put a wrench on them when use the flange nut as a jam nut. They're snugged up, but there's really no twisting motion when the sway bar is cycled. There's about 1-1/8" of threaded portion in each joint end.

 

IMG_4285.jpg

 

Driver's side installed.

 

IMG_4286.jpg

 

Passenger side installed.

 

 

Removing and installing them is quite quick as you can see. Of course, this requires laying on the ground, reaching around the tire, and fishing one arm up there. The spring on the 90° joint is far stiffer than the spring on the 180°. It's a little tougher getting the 90° joint off without a glove, but I also have some small concerns about pinch points.

 

I've not taken it for a drive yet. When shaking the sway bar, the upper joint did rattle a little. But unless the entire bar is rattling, I don't anticipate enough noise to bother me. I'll follow up when I do take it for a ride.

 

I also had to rotate the 180° joint's opening a specific way because of design/manufacturing shortcomings on the joint. Only under a certain orientation with the ball stay centered in the socket with the slight angle of the link. With the way it's oriented, it has the best chance to stay centered or re-center on travel.

 

When removed, the bar will rotate down and rest on the 3rd member, which isn't desirable. For now, I'm not worrying about it...I don't plan to have it disconnected anytime soon. I just needed longer links, and these are about 3" longer to account for that amount of lift I have. But when I do circle back on it, I'll revisit ideas on how to pin it up or how to let it rest on the 3rd member.

Edited by hawairish
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Well, drove it around a bit, and there's a little chatter. Not terribly overbearing, but noticeable even on flat roads. It can be drowned out with a little stereo volume. I'm ok with it, I just feel better having the sway bar back on at this point (the difference was noticeable on the first turn.)

 

I think I may revisit a previous idea to use some sort of bungee or spring to compress the link together, essentially keeping the balls seated into the sockets. I think it's just the 180° joint that's making the noise, so I may even just make that end a 90° and fashion an L mount for it.

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  • 1 month later...

Sweet! Glad you followed up on this. It's something I've been thinking about for awhile. I wish I had an idea for keeping the sway bar out of the way while disconnected or something to contribute at all, but am working on too many other projects. Here's a bump for this thread at least!

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  • 2 weeks later...

This is what I have found, just whether the locking pin is strong enough, the sway bars get quite a lot of force through them. I broke a front swaybar mount off a strut!

 

These ones are for a patrol, quite strange that they are opposite if they were to fit our trucks. Front would be rear and rear would be front! Adjustable helps ease a bit of worry whether they would fit.

 

psrpat-004-sway-bar-drop-out-link-pins-4

psrpat-005-sway-bar-drop-out-link-pins-4

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  • 1 year later...

To be honest I totally forgot about that(in regard to attaching to the strut. The only way I can think to verify is to turn the wheel all the way to one side, and try to eyeball if the new joint will have that much rotation. This would also remove a heim style joint from a possibility up front as well.

 

If only I had thought of this sooner I could have investigated it when I was doing my brakes this morning(upgraded to hawk LTS, HUGE difference especially when combined with finally adjusting my LSV after the lift).

 

I'm going to remove the rear sway for the trip in a couple weekends, and get the rear sorted and fabbed up. I may just leave the front the heck alone until I'm able to turn this truck into a camping/wheeling only rig(probably a year or more away).

 

 

Well, drove it around a bit, and there's a little chatter. Not terribly overbearing, but noticeable even on flat roads. It can be drowned out with a little stereo volume. I'm ok with it, I just feel better having the sway bar back on at this point (the difference was noticeable on the first turn.)

 

I think I may revisit a previous idea to use some sort of bungee or spring to compress the link together, essentially keeping the balls seated into the sockets. I think it's just the 180° joint that's making the noise, so I may even just make that end a 90° and fashion an L mount for it.

 

Let me start with what a great back & forth this was between the two of you! As I contemplate overhauling my suspension, thie subject of sway bars has been on my mind. Like yourselves, I would really like to preserve the ability to have the sway bars for on-road performance & safety but be able to disconnect them for off-road. I really appreciate all the thought & care that went into your collaboration. All that said, it looks like your conclusion was fairly dissatisfying. I'm wondering where all of this has left you today.

 

hawairish are you still driving around with the disconnects installed? Did you ever do the fronts? Would you do it again?

 

NovaPath, did you ever put yours on & what your experience?

 

Thanks Guys!!

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Let me start with what a great back & forth this was between the two of you! As I contemplate overhauling my suspension, thie subject of sway bars has been on my mind. Like yourselves, I would really like to preserve the ability to have the sway bars for on-road performance & safety but be able to disconnect them for off-road. I really appreciate all the thought & care that went into your collaboration. All that said, it looks like your conclusion was fairly dissatisfying. I'm wondering where all of this has left you today.

 

hawairish are you still driving around with the disconnects installed? Did you ever do the fronts? Would you do it again?

 

NovaPath, did you ever put yours on & what your experience?

 

Thanks Guys!!

 

Funny you should ask. I removed the sway bar and links for an off-road trip just last week, and that might have been the only time since my last post.

 

The hang-up for me was just not coming up with a good way to pin the sway bar up. I liked the idea of some sort of secondary bungee or spring that allowed the ends of the sway to 'float' when the links were disconnected. A bracket on the axle side would be annoying to reach with the tires in the way.

 

It was also evident that over time, dirt got into the joints I used, which made it a little difficult to remove. Add to the fact my complaints about the spring density making one side tougher to compress. I will note that the joints have otherwise held up well over the years without any maintenance, but there was always some chatter to them.

 

Lastly, street driving to and from the trail without the sway bar was just too noticeable for me...and not having it while on the trail was not noticeable enough (except when I was bombing through the trail and kind of wished it was still attached). My springs are worn, so that's probably a factor. I'll be going the LR spring route soon, and will probably put the bar back on today actually (have some highway driving tomorrow). I'm also going to see about using these front sway bar end links for a 05-09 LR3 to replace the disconnects:

 

45G20788_Primary__ra_p.jpg

 

They look longer than the stock links, and instead of a fixed shaft at the top (RH side in the pic), there's a joint on them. Not sure the stud sizes, but I'll make it work.

 

No plans to do the fronts, pretty much for the same reasons. Because of the angle of the bar ends, there's no good place to pin them up without contact from some other component.

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One of the reasons I choose the Pathfinder back in 2002 (despite my prior vehicles being a Z & Maxima) was that it's handling was quite a bit cripser than all of the competition at the time and I knew that it would be used as a "touring" vehicle. I've literally driven it coast to coast & to virtually all 4 corners of the U.S. and some of Canada. I have gone through 2 sets of AirLift 1000s, though I think they have been functional far less than half the time. Otherwise, I haven't done anything else to the suspension. I've run Toyo Open Country AT & ATIIs thoughout. Nearly all of the 106K miles on it were put there by me over the past 15 years. Consequently, I have a pretty good feel for how it's supposed to ride (on pavement & gravel in particular) and I was surprised by the feel of Micah's rig which made me realize I needed to think hard about my sway bars in my coming build out. In the past several months I've been in Micah's R50 both before & after the LR rear springs upgrade. Micah feels the LR springs made a significant difference for him but I definitely noted sway in both cases which was new to my R50 experience. I suspected it was his rear sway bar deletion but matters are complicated by his "death wobble" from degraded lower control arms.

 

Initially, I had assumed I would remove the rear sway bar as it seems nearly everybody does. I also was taking into account a bit of an evolution of my rig into much more of a dedicated camping & offroad rig with much less "touring". However, essentially any off road adventure here still requires a couple hours of crowded, high speed, highway driving, often on slick roads. Plus, I'm now carrying the precious cargo of my two small kids and my truck is going to be much more heavily loaded. When I was younger, it was just me and a single passenger, the gear never rose above the back of the rear seats where I would often net it down. Now, I've gone from spare, primitive camping to a family of 4 with more decadant camping equipment. Not only do I have greater passenger & gear weight, but I'm more top heavy because I've started to use Plano boxes on the roof to simplify departure & campside access for the wife & kids.

 

All of this has really made me think about my sway bars. I've read enough to think I wouldn't feel particularly safe without the front sway bar but I was beginning to question my assumption that I would take the rear off. Your efforts to try and have the best of both worlds was perfect. I really respect the carefull thought you put into your projects and your goals tend to be similar to my own. I had seen the WP disconnects but had the same concerns regarding metal on metal. I can't say I had thought through the other implications of the loose bar quite yet. I really appreciated this thread as the two of you went to great lengths and into great detail to surmount these problems. I Ifeel that the you have explored this in a far more detailed fashion than I ever could have. I was also willing to go to the effort to duplicate your work if you felt the results were worthwhile. In the end, I guess I'm glad to hear you say you missed the sway bar in on-road and didn't notice a huge difference off road (except occasionally wishing it was actually there). I take it by your discussion of replacing them that you actually think keeping the rear in place is better. Therefore, I think I will just replace my bushings and keep the rear sway bar intact as well. It does ound like I should consider the LR front sway bar end links you've mentioned above. Those are going to go on the rear, right? Luckily, I expect you will have trialed it before I get to that point. Let me know how it goes as I will be happy to follow your lead.

 

Thanks again!!

 

 

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Funny you should ask. I removed the sway bar and links for an off-road trip just last week, and that might have been the only time since my last post.

 

The hang-up for me was just not coming up with a good way to pin the sway bar up. I liked the idea of some sort of secondary bungee or spring that allowed the ends of the sway to 'float' when the links were disconnected. A bracket on the axle side would be annoying to reach with the tires in the way.

 

It was also evident that over time, dirt got into the joints I used, which made it a little difficult to remove. Add to the fact my complaints about the spring density making one side tougher to compress. I will note that the joints have otherwise held up well over the years without any maintenance, but there was always some chatter to them.

 

Lastly, street driving to and from the trail without the sway bar was just too noticeable for me...and not having it while on the trail was not noticeable enough (except when I was bombing through the trail and kind of wished it was still attached). My springs are worn, so that's probably a factor. I'll be going the LR spring route soon, and will probably put the bar back on today actually (have some highway driving tomorrow). I'm also going to see about using these front sway bar end links for a 05-09 LR3 to replace the disconnects:

 

45G20788_Primary__ra_p.jpg

 

They look longer than the stock links, and instead of a fixed shaft at the top (RH side in the pic), there's a joint on them. Not sure the stud sizes, but I'll make it work.

 

No plans to do the fronts, pretty much for the same reasons. Because of the angle of the bar ends, there's no good place to pin them up without contact from some other component.

I'll be interested to see your results from the LR3 disconnects, if it works out I'll definitely be switching to this when I need to replace them again. Strange how so much Land Rover stuff fits on the rear of our rigs, and it took 20 years for anybody to notice...

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Plus, I'm now carrying the precious cargo of my two small kids and my truck is going to be much more heavily loaded.

 

You and I are in the same boat. I've got two young kids and there's no shortage of gear to haul (both of which were factors for my cargo rack...I still owe you some dimensions). I mentioned my pucker moment earlier in the post...I put it back on today. I don't think there are gobs of articulation to be had by removing the sway bar...or at least not enough to really warrant removal for me personally, all things considered. I think at this point, it's more important to get the panhard bar down to the right level to maximize articulation when I get the LR springs (hint: I'm making a bracket...in fact, I just glued together a wooden version 15 minutes ago.)

 

I'll be interested to see your results from the LR3 disconnects, if it works out I'll definitely be switching to this when I need to replace them again. Strange how so much Land Rover stuff fits on the rear of our rigs, and it took 20 years for anybody to notice...

 

I think you mean just end links and not disconnects, but yeah, it would be great if those work. I was planning to cut up some OE ones and extend them, but this seems like a much easier option if it's the right length. I kept hoping to find some 4Runners versions that were longer, since they have pretty much the exact same design as ours.

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Yeah I totally meant end links, lol. I've never felt the need to remove my rear sway bar, I get more than enough flex and now that I have wider tires and wheels that pome out I have too much flex. To each their own I suppose, but I like the handling how it is.

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Yeah I totally meant end links, lol. I've never felt the need to remove my rear sway bar, I get more than enough flex and now that I have wider tires and wheels that pome out I have too much flex. To each their own I suppose, but I like the handling how it is.

 

Agreed. I like the handling as-is, too. I only removed it this time around because of the trail I was running, but in reality, didn't seem any profound effect.

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  • 1 month later...

Well, I received the LR3 links today, and I think they're going to do the trick:

 

fullsizeoutput_1010.jpg

 

The angle of the pic doesn't show exactly what I was hoping it would, but length from lower ball center to upper mount (not the stud, but where the upper will rest against the OE bracket) is 10.75" LR3 vs. 7" OE link. The studs are 12mm vs 10mm OE, so you will need to drill out the bracket and sway bar ends to fit them. But if you've gotten this far in terms of rear lift, this is trivial. I drilled mine out to 1/2" long ago when I installed my disconnects, so I'm ready to go.

 

I'll try to install them tonight. Not anticipating any fitment issue, but I will note the top stud is about .25" longer than OE. This particular part is Ultra Power K750334, fitment for 05-09 LR3 and 10-16 LR4 Land Rovers. Paid just under $20 for the pair, before shipping from RockAuto.

 

Edited by hawairish
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  • 2 weeks later...

Glad to see you finally go this sorted Hawairish! I saw a lifted R50 the other day, and it made me miss mine quite a bit. These pathfinders are such a under appreciated and misunderstood rig...phenomenal vehicles that the aftermarket world nor the resale value has seemed to latch on to.

 

Unrelated to that, I'm taking the JKU up to Windrock in two weeks. It's now sitting on 33's with a 2.5" lift and full undercarriage armor. I knew I couldn't leave it stock for long...I can definitely appreciate the aftermarket world of this JK after trying to garage engineer the pathy for a few years.

 

Hope all is well,

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  • 3 weeks later...

I'll try to install them tonight.

 

I really meant "eventually". But, they're installed finally, and I think for those in 4"+ lift realm, these are gonna work just fine.

 

0_DDC622_E-_F415-49_D2-_B478-_B9_F4_A48_

 

462587_AF-1_F07-4_F53-9478-3_E413_A8_C8_

 

I did have some minor difficulties installing them, mainly because the upper mounting bracket is very impractical, and because the length of the stud and size of the joint doesn't give much space between the end of the sway bar and the trailing arm. The upper brackets need to be unbolted from the truck, then attached to the link, then reattached to the truck before connecting the lower end to the sway bar because there's not enough room to rotate the brackets up. But even when done in that order, it's tricky angling the lower stud into the sway bar...you may need to lift the truck a bit for clearance (I installed mine on the ground).

 

I was tempted to cut off the extra stud length, but the end has a hex head used for keeping the joint stationary while tightening the nut. I imagine a boulder will probably bend the studs given my usage, but I suppose I'll chance that over needing to destroy the link if I were to cut the stud off.

 

Right now, the links hang a bit below my trailing arms, which isn't good for my use. I currently have worn OME springs and 2" spacers, with the LR springs lurking in the shadows to hopefully resolve that issue. With that said, if you're not running close to 4" of rear lift, the joints may exposed to trail carnage. It's also worth nothing that both of my control arms are bent, which also exposes them a little more. That'll get addressed soon.

 

Lastly...if anyone is interested in my disconnects, let me know!

Edited by hawairish
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  • 1 year later...

Adding some dimensions for OE links.  Pic for general reference:

 

ZMS30801-FRO-ra-p.jpg

 

Overall length (center of joint stud to end of top post): 8-1/4"

Install length (center of joint stud to center of post bushings, uncompressed): 6-7/8" (compression probably reduces it by 1/8" to 1/4")

Post length: 2-1/8"

Post thread length: 3/4"

Joint stud length: 7/8"

Shaft diameter: .395" (might vary on OE vs. aftermarket)

Threads (both ends): M10 x 1.25

 

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