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Can't Stop Front End From Shaking at Certian Speeds


brc19761
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Hi,

 

I have a 1994 Nissan Pathfinder LE 4x4 with only 84,000 miles. Since I bought the truck it will start shaking and shimming between 55-70 mph. I rotated the tires. Had the tires re-balanced four times. I have jacked the truck up and everything felt very tight. I couldn't find any thing loose.

 

I bought brand new Good Year tires this week and I thought it may have solved the problem. I thought the old tires may be out of round or something. But I left on a trip this weekend and when I hit the highway and interstate the same shaking was there. It makes things rattle in the cabin and you can see the hood shaking b/t 55-70 mph. It is in perfect alignment it just shakes and shimmies. My next thought was shocks, but I hate to keep spending money and can't solve the problem.

 

Anyone have any idea what could be causing this? I don't know much about front end parts and what to look for. All I know is that I checked everthing and nothing was loose. There is no bent rims. Just looking for some suggestions.

 

Thanks,

 

brc

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You've already eliminated everything I was going to suggest, except for like what Skibumbrian mentioned, more specifically would be your tie rod ends, if you have any play in your steering wheel that would be a sign. If they are worn, they not able to hold the steering linkage steady, so you hit that highway speed and your front tires are just wobbling back and forth. I did have a set of bent rims once that had me really looking for everything...and then the guy shows me the tire going up and down when being balance on the machine....then it was all four rims and tires!

 

It could be your shocks as well if they are really worn out and shot...but you would readily be able to discern that just by driving down the road at low speed and hit a bump. Also..make sure your using the correct style / type of lugnuts, the rims on your truck mount hubcentrically, so if you are using lug centric lug nuts, they may not be securing your rim correctly even though they are tight. I'm pretty sure I've got that all layed out right..someone back me up on this or correct me please.

 

This would be an oddball thing that could stare you right in the face and you'd never know it if you didn't know about the hub-centric wheel mounting. You put the wheel on, screw on the lug nuts and you think they're tight but there is still a tinsy little bit of play in there....yep.

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As both above said, check out your bushings in front and rear, the panhard bushings could cause a vibration/shake as it's keeping the rear axle centered, if loose the axle assembly could be slightly moving left and right at speed the process would be more noticeable than at speed, also check out the bushings on the four links. As for shocks they can give you a false sense of working at low speed, but as u speed up the inertia involved causes a bad shock to start jumping, on our semi trailer we can have 34000 lbs on the axle assembly and yet with bad shocks the axles will hop down the freeway and cause the whole cab of truck to vibrate and shake really bad, so I think I would pull the shocks and test them out of the truck. Hope you can get it fixed and this helps you out. :)

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Thanks for all the replies. I do have some questions to your comments. I bought my Pathfinder almost almost two years ago. It only had 72,000 original miles on it and it now has 84,000 miles on it. Everything on it was original. It even has the original window sticker price in the glove box. No rust at all on the frame or body. The tires and lugnuts are oem. I know this may sound like a stupid question, but what would worn bushings look like? The truck is 20 years old and no matter what the milage I know that things like rubber can become britle and start to decay. I will also check the tie rods but there seems to be no play in the steering wheel. When I was getting the new tires put on I thought about going on and getting a front end ailignment. But I wanted to see first if the new tires would solve the problem. You can let go of the steering wheel and the truck goes perfectly straight down the road. It is not wondering to the left or right. What would be the benefits of a front end ailgnment?

 

Thanks for the comments and suggestions. I will check each one mentioned.

 

brc

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It sounds to me like something is still out of balance. I had caked mud on the inside of my wheel once and it created a terrible shake at speeds 40-70. Either side of those speeds and it was buttery smooth though.

 

If you took it to the same shop to get the wheels rebalanced, try again but at a different shop.

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I'm not an alignment expert by any means, but too much tow in (front of the tires V towards one another) and they can fight each other, and too little (or too much?) castor can make them act like a shopping cart's front wheels flapping around... I always recommend getting an alignment when having new tires put on, it rules out one possible problem and generally makes them last longer.

Added benefit is that the tech might tip you off to a problem they noticed. You can always take it home and look/change it yourself...

I get 'lifetime' alignments at Firestone. They pay for themselves quick, and while some people have reported issues, I think it is more the shop you take it to. Besides, I'll take it back every day until they get it right; if that isn't incentive, what is? :D

 

B

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When did you buy this truck, like how long have you had it I mean. If the previous owner had been offroading in it and got some mud in the rims or just a couple clumps of sticky gummy mud or clay may still be stuck the the back of your rims or on the inside of the rim, you know like if you were stick your hand through the little slots in the rim, you could have some dirt clods stuck up inside there, so you wouldn't see it even though you've got new tires...they would have been hell to get to balance on a machine though.

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Thanks so much for taking time to reply. I haven't been able to even jack the truck up and look at anything yet. I have a two bay shop to pull it in, but everytime I have attempted to check it out this week after work the weather has been a factor. I live in South MS and we have been dealing with severe weather for the last couple of days. They had a F-2 tornado come through yesterday a few counties above us. Now everyone is dealing with flooding. But where I live it will not flood.

 

I have had the truck for almost two years. I have drove the D21 Nissan trucks my whole life. I had been on the lookout for a WD21 Pathfinder for a while. I couldn't find one anywhere for a long time. I started looking online and everything I found was either too far away to look at or had 250,000 + miles on them. Finally, I found one on cars.com that with no pics, but said it had only 72,000 miles on it. I figured of course it was a rebuilt motor. I contacted the owner and he said no the miles were original. He had bought the Pathfinder two years earlier from a doctor who kept it garaged. When I finally went to look at it I could not believe the shape it was in. The interior looked brand new. It was a LE so it had all the options. The leather seats looked new. The four wheel drive worked. It has a couple of dents and scratches on the exterior. I bought it and when I got it home I jacked it up and there was no way this truck had been an off roader. Everything looked new and it had not been pressure washed. The owner gave me a maintenance book he had been keeping since he bought it in 2010 (I bought in 2012). The timing belt had been changed, all the fluids, and the sparkplugs all done at a Nissan dealership.

 

I have been working on it a little along. I wanted to keep it original b/c of the shape it was in. I put on new brakes. I replaced the factory radio and cd player ( b/c the radio worked but the cd player did not) they looked like one unit, but they were sperate. I replaced it with a 1999 altima radio that had both tape and cd. I just replaced the speakers finally b/c the others had dry rotted and sounded bad. I received so much info. from the great people on this forum. Just like the door open icon stayed lite up on the dash. I asked on this forum and was told to raise the latch on the back tailgate (or whatever it is called :) and it still works to this day. The Cruise control stopped working. I made a post and it was the plastic piece had broke where the gas pedal touches the cruise control module. Same thing with the rear brake lights they would not go off. I made a post and it was the plastic piece had broke on the brake pedal that touches the pin that turns them off. That is just a few things the people and this forum has helped me and saved me a lot of cash. Even in this post I realized what was wrong with my 1997 Nissan Hardbody 4x4. The steering wheel has got a lot of slack in it and it is tough keeping the truck straight on the highway b/c of the steering wheel slack. Now I know tie rods (thanks :).

 

So, on the front end issue I will check out everything that was given to me. I am a diy person and I like doing things myself. But if it beyond my "paygrade" I will give up and take it to a professional. It is a clean little Pathfinder that still has a lot of life in it and I want to keep it up as best I can or my wallet lets me.

 

I have thought about things such as a motor mount being broke, but I am pretty sure it's not that. I have even though about the drive shaft being out of balance. You nice people just give me the great advice you have in the past and the presant and I will apply it the best I can.

 

Are the bushings the rubber pieces between the parts on the front end?

 

Sorry for such a long post just wanted to explain things as best I could and to thank everyone and the forum. By the way I bought a 2008 Pathfinder with low miles on it in late January and technology sure has come a long way on the Pathfinder. I do not like the new Pathfinders. They look like station wagons and are more like a cross over suv. I think nissan messed this up. But that is what people are looking for now and I see a lot of them on the roads.

 

brc

 

 

Edited by brc19761
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Agree with that, although you know what these tyre guys are like, they won't clean off dirt clods from your wheel arch, they are going to do your tyre fittings, balance em and that's it! Any cleaning of mud is up to the owner. My Pathy was shaking so bad, the steering wheel would literally shake and vibrate so bad, you'd have to fight the wheel to keep it in a somewhat straight line. I would actually get sore hands just from driving the thing. I got new idler arm, front bushings replaced, upper and lower control arm bushings and sway bar bushings replaced, new front shocks. To finish off, new wheel alignment. All all this solved the steering issues but it was very expensive! But worth it if you love your Pathy!

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  I do not like the new Pathfinders.  They look like station wagons and are more like a cross over suv.  I think nissan messed this up.  But that is what people are looking for now and I see a lot of them on the roads.

 

brc

 

 

I actually just saw a new pathy today, and I was saying to myself wow, they really beefed up the murano, then saw the pathfinder badge and just shook my head...

 

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Oh and yes, the bushings are the round rubber things that go between the 'knuckles' either side on the inside of the front and rear wheels. Climb under the front and have a look. You'll see them in there, between the metal rods. If they are in good condition they should look nice and fat, just under an inch in width. If they are cracked and squashed like a pancake then yeah, I'd get them replaced. Your rig sounds sweet, mine was similar story, it was garaged and looked pretty much brand new - interior spotless, little minor rust near back left passenger entrance but was just surface rust and easy to polish out. The other thing it had was the air vent surrounds had melted from the hot sun but apart from that everything else was ok. These cars are going to last forever if you keep on the maintenance so they are well worth hanging onto, maybe even going up in price one day since they are becoming a rare beast and many are approaching the 25th anniversary date too.

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Thanks for the replies. I bet it will be a tie rod or bushing factor. Just have to find the time this week to look at it. May get a chance today. But Thursday will definately have the time.

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If you haven't yet, I highly recommend you go to the Garage section and into the pinned thread on Factory Service Manuals to download your own free copy. It is the DIY persons bible, and in this case, go to FA-4 for a view of the front suspension components. I find it helps to study a drawing and maybe read a little before examining/working on the truck.

 

Good luck with the dangerous weather conditions down there!

 

B

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I finally was able to get under the front end and did a thorough check on the entire front end. The thing that stood out the most to me were the shape the bushings that on the piece that holds the lower A arms. The piece had two bushings on it and the end had threads and had a nut on the end. These two bushings were rock hard and had signs of decay. Would this cause the truck to shake at higher speeds? I also noticed a small bit of slack in the steering, but tie rods seemed ok to me (but I don't what ok would mean). I checked the torsion bars. The driver side bar you could see the teeth at the end of it were not completely in its slot. The passenger side bar looked like it was fully flush with no teeth showing. But it was the same way on my 1997 Nissan hardbody 4x4. Which by the definately needs a new passenger side tie rod end.

 

I don't know if any of this helped. Is there anything I am overlooking? Can you buy new bushings at a local autozone or is it a dealer part? Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

 

brc

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I finally was able to get under the front end and did a thorough check on the entire front end. The thing that stood out the most to me were the shape the bushings that on the piece that holds the lower A arms. The piece had two bushings on it and the end had threads and had a nut on the end. These two bushings were rock hard and had signs of decay. Would this cause the truck to shake at higher speeds?

Yes, it would. You should be able to walk into your local auto parts store and speak to a guy in there who looks like he has the knowledge of what you need. In other words, speak to the grey haired guy, not the 16 yr old kid who wouldn't know the difference between a radiator hose and a brake pedal.

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Remember to check the rear bushes too, if the back end is swaying side to side as you come to a stop then yeah they are stuffed. So what you need is front and rear bushes, front tie rod end bushes, upper and lower control arm bushes and idler arm bushes. The whole lot. Add shockies to that list as well if they haven't been replaced in the last 100k miles.

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A big 10-4 on that one. Also spraying wd-40 on the adjusting rod ends will help the wheel alignment guys. I was sent away by the tyre shop they tried a pry bar on those bolts and they wouldn't budge so they said spray them every day for a week and then come back. So I sprayed wd-40 every morning for a whole week and then went back, finally the bolts turned so they could do the adjustment! I now spray them every time I change the oil just to keep them in shape so I don't have to go through the same hassle as last time.

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Please, WD-40 is for water displacement, sticker removal or maybe lubricating a lock. You are far better off using a true penetrating oil, here in the US I recommend PB Blaster, Liquid Wrench, Kroil and the like. I'm not sure what brands are available in other countries... :shrug:

 

 

After you put all the bushings and tie rod busings in I would assume you may need a front end ailgnment?

It really depends how much you replace, and what. Tie rod ends and control arm bushings would probably want an alignment. Torsion rod bushings, sway bar bushings, Idler arm bushings shouldn't.

 

B

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I finally was able to get under the front end and did a thorough check on the entire front end. The thing that stood out the most to me were the shape the bushings that on the piece that holds the lower A arms. The piece had two bushings on it and the end had threads and had a nut on the end. These two bushings were rock hard and had signs of decay. Would this cause the truck to shake at higher speeds? I also noticed a small bit of slack in the steering, but tie rods seemed ok to me (but I don't what ok would mean). I checked the torsion bars. The driver side bar you could see the teeth at the end of it were not completely in its slot. The passenger side bar looked like it was fully flush with no teeth showing. But it was the same way on my 1997 Nissan hardbody 4x4. Which by the definately needs a new passenger side tie rod end.

 

I don't know if any of this helped. Is there anything I am overlooking? Can you buy new bushings at a local autozone or is it a dealer part? Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks,

 

brc

 

I believe you are talking about the torsion rod bushings (strut rod bushings)? They come off of the rear of the lower A arms and go through the frame, one bushing on either side?

If so, yes, if you think they look bad now, wait until you take it apart! They are a heavy wear item and are usually overlooked and in bad shape. They can definitely cause (allow) the front to shake as they are supposed to hold things in place.

It isn't hard to change at all as long as it isn't rusted together and you have the tools. I would go ahead any plan to change them regardless and see how it drives then rather than change everything at once. You have a choice between Dealership rubber and aftermarket rubber and polyurethane bushings. There are many threads about this problem here, some in the Garage/How To section as well.

 

Let me know if you can't find them.

 

Hard to diagnose 'a little steering slack' but another cheap/easy is to rebuild the factory idler arm. 3 or 4 bolts hold it on and one nut holds it together. there are two plastic bushings inside the body that can be had for a few dollars at the Dealer. Take the old out, put the new in with grease, reinstall and it is one less loose item. ;)

 

B

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  • 2 weeks later...

A update on what I have done so far. New tires and balance. I replaced the strut rod bushings. I noticed when replacing the strut rod bushings that there was no rust and the factory bushings were not in to bad of shape. It only has 85,000 original miles. 0-50 mph drives perfectly smooth. 55-75 mph it shakes BAD. I want this pathfinder to be my daily driver. So, what do I need to do next?

 

Thanks,

 

brc

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