tmorgan4 Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 (edited) I finally decided that I'm going to start building these links. I've talked about it with a few people for a long time and never really went through with it. I was hoping to see the pre-order go through but unfortunately that didn't work out. I've got a little bit different approach to how to build them since I'd be doing all the welding myself. I played with the idea of making them adjustable length-wise but I really don't think this necessary for most people. The links will be built with a polyurethane bushing on one side, and the buyers choice of another polyurethane bushing or a flex joint on the other side. I like the flex joints a lot but they cost more money. I promise you'll be impressed when you receive them. The welds will be very nice. Why they make sense: 1) The last time I priced this out it's quite a bit cheaper than OEM Nissan parts. Buying the whole replacement link with bushings already installed makes installation the easiest, but you're going to pay for the parts. The replacement bushings aren't too expensive to purchase but paying someone to torch the old ones out and press the new bushings in can add a lot to the cost of install. This is the same way for the replacement poly bushings that 4x4parts.com sells however the bushings really aren't cheap and neither is the install. 2) The new links will come ready to bolt in. Bushings installed, and new hardware if you need it. The hardware often rusts to the metal sleeve inside the bushings with makes it necessary to cut the bolt to get the link out. No taking it to a mechanic who has a press. 3) It will improve the handling and ride quality of the suspension. I'll get some pictures of my old rubber bushings to explain. They are completely torn to where there are two separate pieces. This makes the ride quality way too soft with lots of movement and ultimately leads to the sway problems many have experienced. 4) The new links will be made of a stronger material than the OEM parts. The stock links are very thin and exposed. They're really a lot easier to bend than you might think. The new ones shouldn't bend. What I need: I don't want to take money from anyone yet. People are worried enough to try them out since this is something new so I'm going to build a set for free. If anyone wants to buy the parts and have them shipped to my house I'll assemble them and send them back for the cost of parts (and you get to cover shipping!). Once someone gets them installed I think it will be clear just how much of a difference these really make. Any takers? Edited May 26, 2009 by tmorgan4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekazgtr1984 Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 PM sent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUELER Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 (edited) I can vouch for Tyler - great seller and very trustworthy. I would buy a set but i already pressed in poly bushings into the stock LCA's. Yes pressing the stock ones out was a pain in the ass (destroyed a 10,000 lb press) i wish these links were available it would have been much easier! If you don't already have upgraded LCA's, i highly recommend it. Noticeable improvement in handling. Makes the SUV handle much more precisely both on road and off, you can thrash the suspension all you want and you never have to worry about death wobble or cracked bushings again! Edited May 26, 2009 by FUELER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zibi Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 I'd be interested, I need new bushings all around. Would these just be rear LCAs or would they also be uppers and front upper and lower control arms? It basically comes down to cost. I need to replace my bushings soonish and only really can afford to make sure my truck is safe and in good mechanical order. So if they cost near to or less than the amount of an OEM set shipped then I'd definitely be interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
01silvapathy Posted May 26, 2009 Share Posted May 26, 2009 Id be very interested, its always just a matter of the price and also If I get enough money over the summer to pay for some. Also any pics would help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted May 26, 2009 Author Share Posted May 26, 2009 (edited) Glad to see a little bit of interest here! It's always hard to speculate whether something will sell or not but I think with this crowd it just needs to be done. This seems like one of the reasons the pre-order fell through. Nobody wants to pre-order parts....make them up front, and then sell them. I'm looking into pricing on these and it really depends a lot on options. Those would include: Adjustable length. Poly bushings, flex joints, or one of each. Track bar. Tube thickness Hardware I'll build the first set and see how much it really costs from beginning to end. There's probably about 2 hours welding involved in each set. Edited May 26, 2009 by tmorgan4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganAve Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Tyler, Just to clarify, you are thinking of making some new rear lower control arms? I'd be down. I'd be interested in the adjustable length ones, using poly bushings on one end and a flex joint on the other. You are also talking about making a new track bar/panhard rod? I assume you are thinking about longer/adjustable length ones? Did you ever make a drop bracket for your track bar? I think that's what you and I really need to get the geometry right. With time my rear end has shifted to the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fukinitupagain Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Yeah I'd be interested in an adjustable panhard bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY1PATH Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Having the panhard bar run parallel to the axle or 1-2deg upwards to the frame to conteract acceleration squat is Ideal. Running it 1-2deg upwards also allows it to stay closer to parallel when the vehcle is loaded. Thats how I did mine, my lift was 3" in back but my bracket was only a 2.5" drop that combined with my new rancho's keeps the vehcile very level under acceleration. and when I have passengers in back it sags .5" so the bar is perfectly level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 Having the panhard bar run parallel to the axle or 1-2deg upwards to the frame to conteract acceleration squat is Ideal.Running it 1-2deg upwards also allows it to stay closer to parallel when the vehcle is loaded. Thats how I did mine, my lift was 3" in back but my bracket was only a 2.5" drop that combined with my new rancho's keeps the vehcile very level under acceleration. and when I have passengers in back it sags .5" so the bar is perfectly level. I do appreciate the suggestions but there are quite a few things that I have to respectfully disagree with. The amount that your suspension will squat (or rise) under acceleration has absolutely nothing to do with the angle on the panhard. The panhard bar lives an easy life as it's only job is to keep the axle located laterally under the axle. The lengths and mounting locations of the other 4 links are what dictate 100% of the anti-squat behavior under acceleration. Putting a 1 or 2 degree angle on the panhard is what I would call flat. There is absolutely no way to plan out exactly how much everything will weigh that you're going to carry to keep it here. With the stock R50 coils springrate of 115 in/lbs it's pretty obvious that adding 50 pounds (let alone a friend or two!) is going to change this angle pretty dramatically. Getting the panhard back to being flat is more ideal than having an adjustable panhard. Both is probably a good option so you can adjust as a lift settles or if you decide to add a heavy rear bumper or other accessories. I did design a drop bracket quite a while back....I'll send that file off and get a quote on what a final piece will cost to get laser cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 Yeah I'd be interested in an adjustable panhard bar. Right on! I'm interested to see how much the drop bracket ends up being as it might be a whole lot cheaper than building a new panhard bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
180sx Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 New LCA's!!! Man, I have the death wobble bad ( I mean, just driving down a regular road it sways) so I need some new stuff. I've been thinking about getting some Poly's from 4x4, (those pre-order ones were way too expensive for my budget) so if these are about the same price as a new stock replacemnt (is it like 100 bucks for a new LCA complete?) than I'm down for a set (well, In like July I can afford - remodeling your home adds up!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FUELER Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 ^^ Keep in mind the stock replacement will eventually go bad again and death sway is guaranteed to return.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 The links I'd be building that would be identical to the stock links with the upgraded bushings and build from heavier duty material would be very competitive with OEM replacement parts. I looked up the prices last night from Courtesy Nissan which is the cheapest dealer I know of and the lower links were between $80-100 each (I can't remember the exact price!) and the uppers were $119 each. For the people wanting a flex joint on one end or adjustability it's going to be a little more expensive than stock parts but it's a huge upgrade at the same time. I'll post up some pictures later tonight of a 4-link rear I just built for an '09 Tacoma. I'm working with a few people on these...it shouldn't take too long to get things going and get some more information and reviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekazgtr1984 Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Oooh, a 4-link rear... I'd like one of those. But a custom, beefed up 5-link will do, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fukinitupagain Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Right on! I'm interested to see how much the drop bracket ends up being as it might be a whole lot cheaper than building a new panhard bar. I'm gonna extend my rear arms b/c I want to run lifted Bronco coils in the rear with the SFD instead of spacers/blocks but I'm wondering if I'm gonna have to modify my panhard bar for this to work. Thats why I was saying I'd be interested in the panhard bar. I think it'll be one of those hurdles I'll tackle when I get there but since you've already done it I was curious as to your thoughts (sorry to hi-jack Tyler but Richard & I discussed this a bit back & never came up with a definate answer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted May 27, 2009 Author Share Posted May 27, 2009 How much are you going to extend the axle back? I could put a jog in the track bar to account for however far it's moving back. I played with the idea a while back but there isn't a ton of room to move it back without having to re-do the upper coil mount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekazgtr1984 Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 I'm gonna extend my rear arms b/c I want to run lifted Bronco coils in the rear with the SFD instead of spacers/blocks but I'm wondering if I'm gonna have to modify my panhard bar for this to work. Thats why I was saying I'd be interested in the panhard bar. I think it'll be one of those hurdles I'll tackle when I get there but since you've already done it I was curious as to your thoughts (sorry to hi-jack Tyler but Richard & I discussed this a bit back & never came up with a definate answer) Bronco coils, eh? Noice! Are there any other options? I'm not too keen on rear coil spacers either. BTW, good to see you, Boston! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
01silvapathy Posted May 27, 2009 Share Posted May 27, 2009 Dude, keep me on the in with this idea also, im not too keen on the coil spacers either, too many things to go wrong IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekazgtr1984 Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 Could these links be used to fab up a custom 4-link rear-end? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nissandoms47 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 if you get a different gas tank ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fukinitupagain Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 if you get a different gas tank ya. That wouldn't be hard to do. You could cut out a decent protion of the trunk & put a fuel cell there plus you could have a larger capacity fuel tank (yeah I've thought about this in the last year or so). Didn't SystemF think about doing this at one point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share Posted June 2, 2009 Yes I have, but all I get is a automated service...that does me no good, casue its been saying the same thing for quite awhile And boston....that steering extension seems to be quite small, atleast going off of the pics that I have seen of other peoples sfd's That's pretty much all there is to it. I just did the exact same thing in a brand new Tacoma since it had the same issue with the gas tank. A 3 link rear would be easy, but I like the idea of moving the tank and doing a 4 link rear better. The whole fuel pump and gauge sending unit can be adapter into a new cell and mounted wherever you please. I ordered enough parts today to make 2 sets of links. One will be a basic OEM replacement with polyurethane bushings on both ends. The other will have one poly bushing and one custom machined flex joint on the other and the overall length will be adjustable. I will have the set with bushings done by Friday hopefully and they will be for sale as soon as they're finished. The flex joints are going to take a couple weeks to get made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekazgtr1984 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 This 4-link rear set-up could be pretty badass, albeit expensive and time-consuming. Tyler, keep us posted on those links! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmorgan4 Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share Posted June 3, 2009 This 4-link rear set-up could be pretty badass, albeit expensive and time-consuming. No kidding! I think expensive is an understatement. I bet the rear 4-link project on the Tacoma is at about $4,000 in parts. And that's with the stock axle and doing all the work for FREE. I hope it's worth it when it's all said and done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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