Aegis
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Posts posted by Aegis
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Great advice from everyone, many thanks once again!
I got the rear driveshaft installed, piece of cake. Torsions bars... Passenger side was great. Driver side did not fully seat in the front, or something?, and ended up slipping in the splines and nearly cost me what sanity I have left. I do not know what I did wrong, had the truck up on stands with the lower control arm jacked as per the manual. All went mostly okay, I think that maybe the snap ring at the back of the bar slipped through the hole or that I was measuring wrong, I was going with factory specs on the measurements. My impact got the bolts where they were suggested, but it was a bit of a butt-clench deal. I had to file the splines on both the bar and the front anchor, but it all fit back together and now holds the weight of the truck. Time will tell how it holds up once I get it rolling. It almost seems like it can slide too far rearward in the rear anchor and allow it to slip too far out of the front anchor which is why it turned loose. I won't know how this goes until I get the truck running.
That leads on to the next part... Once I got the bars in and the truck sitting on it's wheels, I cranked it after the starter decided to co-operate and let it warm up. I then tried to go through the gear, the gear indicator at the shifter still incorrect. It seems to rev and 'bog' accordingly with respect to each gear. It does not pull in reverse, so far. I am going to go out today and start with step one of fixing the control linkage and then moving on to testing the pressure to see if the pump is providing the higher pressure. I will also test to see if the forwards gears work. I was unable to really test last night due to the truck facing the garage and not being able to reverse away. It felt like it was pulling, but it is hard to say. The fluid level seemed fine but I will go over that again once I have tugged the truck back onto a more level spot in the driveway. It sits fairly level where it is now, but pulling it back should let me et a 100% certain answer on the fluid level and test the forward gears again.
As for the starter, I'm going to have a search for the relay diagram once I get this buttoned up or determine it is above my pay grade. I did the headlight relay mod a long time ago, so I know that it is definitely a worthwhile way to get more power where it needs to be. I might check the voltage at the starter later today while I am under the truck with the linkage adjustment.
Again, thanks to all who have contributed. I have yet to find another forum as friendly as this one has been. The old coots over at the Honda Fit forum are close but you guys definitely deserve a beer/coffee!
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Thanks for the replies!
The lack of driveshaft causing the grinding issue occured to me this morning after a night of sleep. I definitely did not do much of that yesterday as it hurt my soul to hear, and I won't be doing it again.
I don't think the old transmission died, so much as had an electrical failure. I plan to really tear into it once I get the truck going and find some free time. To be safe I did flush it, and I do think adding an online filter is not a bad idea as cheap insurance. I'll have to pick up one before I run things much again.
The starter is still being a hit or miss issue. I'll definitely look into the relay wiring write-up. I know getting the relay harness for my headlights helped, so I'd believe it'd be good for the starter, too.
I'll have to check the service manual for adjusting the shifter, I guess that there was a slight difference between the new and old selector position.
By far my biggest regret was having to pull the torsion bars. I am going to have a great time readjusting those. I've seen a few good write ups here, and the service manual seems to have a decent outline of it.
Again, my biggest thanks to you lot for helping me with information. It's been emotional, but great, getting to get my truck running again.
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I finally have the transmission and transfer case back in. The old man came up and helped me wrestle it back in yesterday and we got a lot done in about 8 hours of work. I still need to re-install the torsion bars, exhaust y-pipe, and drive shafts. I held off just to test in case I have to rip it back out. So far everything is trending good, but with a few asterisks there...
First, the truck doesn't always start. Sometimes the key turn does nothing, sometimes it clicks, and sometimes it starts. It has me a bit confused. I thought it might be a loose connection at the starter but I've got it tight, it seems.
Second, the transmission shifter doesn't exactly line up where it used to on the indicator? Reverse looks like neutral, for example. I think it needs adjusted on the cable.
Thirdly, when shifting right after start it is okay. When shifting after it's been running, primarily from reverse back to park, there is a loud grinding sound. I'm not sure what that is, either. I added fluid yesterday and I think it might still be low, I haven't got the truck level and in a place to check it, but going by volume it should be close, maybe a few quarts low. I've never seen that cause grinding, though, only failure to shift.
Aside from all of this, and my cooler line leaking, it seems to be good to go. I do need to double check my flow and be sure I'm not running the cooler backwards.
The install went fairly well. Some bolts are a PITA to reach, wires have to be routed and tucked, vent hose needed to be extended, and it was a bit of a joke to get the truck high enough to get the transmission underneath on the jack, but I'm pretty happy with progress so far.
If anyone has any suggestions for the intermittent starting or transmission grinding, I'd love some input.
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Since you have looked at fuses and relays, and your previous wiring repair, I'd try that. Running a power wire from a 12V source and a ground to the fuel pump plug should tell you if it'll work or not.
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Another update- this time some better news...
I have no idea what broke the rotors, still, but I did figure out that the torque converter drives the transmission oil pump rotor. This is probably common knowledge to some, but was helpful for me. The snout on the torque converter is very helpful to determine which style of rotor (2-lug or milled flat) the transmission should have inside. The snout of the 2-lug converter has two grooves in it, whereas the milled flat converter has two flat spots. This determination made it easier for me with the meat of this update...
I drove after work on Tuesday afternoon from West Atlanta up to St. Louis and stayed the night for a quick trip up to Springfield (Illinois). I found a 2WD Xterra (with VG33ER - Supercharged variant of the 3.3L) transmission that was only $99! I called and had them confirm it all before making the trip and about 1,500 miles of driving in two days later, I made it back last night with the transmission. The big deal was making sure it had the correct converter and input shaft like my Frontier transmission I was swapping in did. The other big deal is for my dumb@$$ NOT to pull the pump apart and break another rotor. I have fiddled some this morning and extracted the pump and tossed the broken pump into the 2WD transmission. I am going to call a local shop that specializes in the Nissan Z cars to see if it would be any use for them.
I will next put the pump from the 2WD transmission into the 4WD transmission and try to get it into the truck soon. So far all looks the exact same and should work out. I guess we'll keep our fingers crossed. I will have to measure a lot before I get under there and wrestle with it.
After this whole ordeal is finished, I hope to write up a big chunk of information on these transmissions, from my layman's perspective, with some photos of the differences (HD vs Non-HD, etc...) and to hopefully help both myself and anyone else in the future digging for info on these trucks where the service manuals fall short.
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Something I am looking into now, as my 3.0 does not need the addition front speed sensor the 3.3 SC / 3.5 uses, is if the differing oil pumps without the sensor could work. They seem to be a bit more abundant. If anyone knows the differences in oil pumps or how to tell which had 2 lugs instead of milled flat, this would be useful as well.
Update: After grabbing the broken pump set from the original 'bad' transmission and comparing, I'm not sure if a different pump will work. The differ in design, obviously, but the input shaft is also different. The odd thing is that my original 'bad' transmission is using the 2 lug rotor rather than the milled flat rotor of the 'HD' variant transmission I bought as a replacement. This is turned into such a fiasco. The only new pump, which I *think* is the correct pump (R73500AC or U73500AC) ((And who's part number THAT is I have no clue, it's just what all the transmission parts companies seem to use...)) (((On top of that, the part number doesn't even correspond to the RE4R01A... I know my replacement transmission was rebuilt at some point, it seems, but I don't think they swapped pumps, too. I am confused beyond anything right now. I wish there was more information about the tiny changes Nissan/Jatco did in these transmissions and which ones went in which vehicles.)))
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I've got the pump pulled apart in the office floor currently...
The only thing I see which could have been an issue is that the top half of the pump (I'm calling the side that the rotor, wiper/actuator arm, and pins slot into the bottom) has a square portion cast into it around where the shaft passes through the center that looks like it interfaces with the inside of the rotor. The top half looks like some of that square metal casting has chipped off. I guess I didn't manage to line the rotor up well enough and caused it to break the rotor and some of that interface. If that was not the case, my only other option as a point of failure looks like the metal ring that slots into the backside of the 'outer ring' portion that the rotor sits inside of. I don't know the proper name for this, the parts diagram shows it with the rotor as unorderable and doesn't include it with a name or part number at all.
I did manage to locate a rotor on a website for G-COR Automotive in Ohio, I think, for $48.00 shipped. It ended up being the wrong rotor as I order without triple checking the design of the broken one. Every website lists them simply as "RE4R01A" rotor with little help between year/design change so I'll have to get back to the search. Just my luck, it seems.
If I ever figure this out I'll keep updating for the benefit of anyone else fumbling their way through this as I am.
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Update - Bad news day...
When I went to line up and check the torque converter to get it all installed today I noticed it looked like the rotor inside was broken. Indeed. I had broken the rotor reassembling the pump, I guess. I'm not sure what caused this. I then, turning to the only other pump set I had on hand tried to remove the pump from the bad transmission. Upon disassembling it from the bellhousing to see that it was okay, I put it back together and have proceeded to break the rotor in it too.
HOW?! I get that clamping force of bolts are strong but I was using a torque wrench set for 13 ft. lbs. I am beyond stumped and frustrated. I have NO IDEA where to source just another rotor. I guess I am going to call the local transmission shop and see about having them just rebuild the thing right and know that I have good seals and that things are good to go. It is just frustrating that I am going to have to dump another chunk more than I paid for the whole damn truck into it again.
Learning experiences...yeesh! I just wish I knew what was putting the rotor under so much stress from barely tightening the bolts. Everything felt and looked lined up. The factory service manual was vague, beyond instructions to mind the orientation of the rotor, but nothing as far as a hint on what that orientation was. I did make sure that I did not flip it when I removed it, so I have no idea.
If anyone has any advice for re-assembling the damn thing, and/or maybe where to get a rotor I'd be eternally grateful. Thanks!
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So, as a quick small update, I have pulled the torque converter off and separated the bell housing and pump from the transmission. I split those, and to my amazement, the vanes for the oil pump are all present and accounted for. The internals I could see of the transmission did not seem as though to be damaged from a rogue vane being chewed through them. That was a small bit of relief. I am now trying to source the seals, o-rings, and filter/screens before I put the transmission back in. I also still need to swap out the flex plate, hopefully that won't be anything too wild.
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Another update... (Sorry this is becoming more of a diary for my own benefit, but I'm hoping it helps with anyone searching for information in the future.)
I got the transmission out, I have got the wires in question (Nissan calls this the "Terminal" or "Terminal Assembly") swapped over as well. I had to swap and solder some of the temperature sensors (I think?) from one harness to the other. To get this out you only have to take the pan off the bottom and unplug/route the wires out. The clip that holds the wiring harness into the side of the transmission comes out fairly easily, with three clips on the inside you squeeze in towards the hole while pulling it outwards. The connectors inside are pretty straight forward and the job is really not too hard. When I opened the pan on my junkyard transmission, though, I was a bit disappointed to find a bit of a white slime (like when water gets in engine oil) and a small rectangular metal piece which was stuck to the pan magnet. A bit of skimming over the exploded parts diagrams and it appears that the rectangular metal piece is a vane from the oil pump rotor. I'm going to attempt to break down my old transmission as a test run to see if I can figure out how the vane got to the bottom of the pan and if it left a path of visible damage on the way down. At this point I'm not giving up, even after discovering that my problem (wouldn't shift from D1 to D2) was likely due to the inhibitor switch and not something with a valve or other internal.
I'm going to swap the transfer cases and use my original, also. The water/??? slime in the transmission wasn't a happy sign, so I'm going to stick with what I know worked in the past since they should be the same internally (the transfer case... case? does have a slightly differing design and a possible extra mounting point that the Frontier/Xterra possibly use.)All in all it's been really slow progress compared to what I was hoping for, but I'm using my corona quarantine time to hopefully get this knocked out for good or bad. It's definitely been one great learning experience as I've never worked this much with automatic transmissions before.
On a side note, if anyone in the NWGA area needs the transfer case from the junkyard transmission, it's sitting in my way and I'd be glad to get rid of it.
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New Year (3 months late update):
Haven't touched the truck since my last post... Transmission is still sitting and caught by the torsion bars. Work has been busy, I hate winter, and it's currently been raining so much that I can hardly find time to get anything done.
Anyway, thanks for the advice on the torsion bars. I did mark them appropriately. My bigger issue, as far as I remember, is that the clips at the back are a PITA to remove. I got the driver's side loose and nearly lost an eye even with safety glasses on.
I have been spending my winter hiatus trying to figure out the plugs on the harness going into the side that I'm not sure about.
I think I'll probably just have to break out the Hakko and solder them, as suggested. I'll definitely be cleaning all the plugs and contacts with cleaner and getting it all clean as I can. I don't think I'll pull the engine, provided it doesn't die, until I absolutely have to. I know it has a big leak, I'm thinking rear main seal which I might try to tackle when I get the transmission loose, if the front differential and crossmembers aren't in the way. Otherwise it'll be an oil pan wherever I park and a "Check the gas and fill up the oil!" Except I do recall my truck running really rich when I ran, so it might just be my bankruptcy.
I'm learning a lot and am eager to get back into it as soon as I don't need a snorkel and flippers so lay under it.
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New update #?
I've gotten the transmission loose from the engine. It is now resting on the crossmembers as I hoped it would wiggle free between them. I suppose I am going to have to jack it up and try to remove the torsion bars. I have never messed with them before and have zero idea how they work. Some forum searches will hopefully lead to something useful and without outdated image hosting.
That also begin said, I am stumped on the "terminal assembly" wiring that goes inside the transmission from the passenger side. It appears to connect to the valves inside the transmission, or something, but I can't seem to get it loose. I have pulled all the wiring for the transmission down and free as that seems to be my easiest option at the moment. The scrapyard cut the wiring on the 'new' transmission, though, so I somehow have to figure out how to swap all of that stuff.
I also never did get the replacement seals or screen. I figured I'd hold off on the seals to see if it even leaks since I reckon I'll pull it back out in spring or summer next year, if all goes well, when I rebuild the engine.
What a time this has been.
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I've now re-reconsidered and have elected to wait in the engine rebuild for the time being. I REALLY want to have it done for some trail action this fall and the machine shops around have either ignored my calls and emails, or gave my a long turn around time. I think I'm going to throw the transmission in and drive her as is for a bit. I guess I just need to keep a catch pan. I won't have to change the oil at least! (Jokes)
I have already started progress on pulling the broken transmission. I removed the exhaust cross over tube; what a pain that was! For some reason my exhaust is plauged with errant welds that a 10 year old with too much sugar could emulate... Maybe even exceed in quality! Thus had one of the bolts on a flange literally welded in place with no room for a grinding wheel. My only two other options were a hand file or a reciprocating saw. I elected for the saw. This still left things difficult but eventually I managed to pry it free. I'll have to do the clean up and find new bolts eventually. Next I did the drive shafts and drained the transmission pan. After that was to unplug the sensors, yank the dipstick/tube, and un-plumb the cooling lines. That's as far as I've gotten thus far, having only a few hours after work each day doesn't make things easy. Neither do mosquitos, for that matter. I hope to get the driver's side cooling line free and drained and maybe the torsion vars off tonight. If I'm lucky I'll get started on the starter or other bellhousing bolts.
I did go and grab an actual transmission jack, I think it'll be a huge help.
On a side note, and I'll probably make a separate post about it later... Is anyone interested in the OEM front brush guard for a WD21? I have the whole assembly. I also have side steps and all the mounting hardware, as well. If anyone does want to discuss them, I'd let them go cheap. I'm not entirely sure about shipping, though. This is all something I intend to muck about with more later if there is no interest at this moment.
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I think that my idea for pulling it and doing a full rebuild is what I'll go with. Having a daily driver that gets great gas mileage and some disposable income to throw at her makes me want to really get her going. If no other reason than to show myself that I can do it, and that I shouldn't regret not buying a new Wrangler.
I guess I'll eventually start a build thread once I get elbows deep into it and continue things there.
In the meantime, thanks to you who have given me advice!
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I got the flex plate in yesterday, it seems to be in good shape. While looking to order seals I thought about things and realized that the rear main probably should be done while the transmission is out. With that being the case I think I might go ahead and pull the engine for a rebuild while I'm at it. I am completely lost on what to do now. I think I'll keep the VG30E, grab a bottom end rebuild kit online, get the block looked at and maybe bored over some? I'm not sure if it NEEDS it, and I hate to spend extra, but most kits look like they come with over sized pistons anyway. I'll probably buy some re-manufactured VG33E heads since the local shop here quoted me "$500-600" to rebuild the VG30E heads. I could do the parts replacing side of the head rebuild myself, but I am already looking at biting off a REALLY big bite as it is and don't know how quirky these things might be. I'll replace the radiator, cooling lines, and vacuum lines while it's all apart as well. I'm kind of just scratching my head and debating so much with myself on what to do. I could do a VG33E swap, but I don't want to buy another used engine, I don't think. The JDM engines are nice but only come as long blocks and aren't any cheaper than the rebuild of the VG30E.
Anyone have 2 cents they'd like to throw in? I'm honestly on the fence about what to do, and as a complete amateur at all of this, I'm excited as it would be my first real 'solo' engine rebuild. I did plan eventually to pull the engine for a rebuild or...something?, anyway, since it leaks really bad on the bottom end and possibly burns oil. It's been running so rich I've had a hard time telling.
Thanks!
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A TD27 would be grand, but alas we can only dream.
Be sure to keep updates on the forum. It'll be useful for the future when you look back and can't remember if you've done something, allow you to get help if you find yourself stuck on anything, and also provides more info for others undertaking the task in the future.
I can't wait to read that you've got it all buttoned up and back on the roads!
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Part diagrams show this nut is part number:
08911-6441A
(Upper Control Arm Retainer Nut)
I haven't had any luck finding what size the nut actually is, though.
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So I think with the help of clearer diagrams from the FSM that maybe I've found the seals and 'filter'. It was a bit confusing with the 'filter' because the parts website shows parts actually labeled as automatic transmission oil filter right above the listing for the oil strainer. I think the oil strainer is the part needed, it most appears the same to all other A/T filters I've seen before.
My part numbers, again listed for mostly my own log, but also for anyone in the future possibly hunting this information as I am now:
Filter/Screen: 3172841X03
Input Shaft Oil Seal: 3137551X03
Output Shaft Oil Seal: 31375-41X01
O-Ring on Input Shaft at Torque Converter: 3115921X00
Oil Pan Gasket: 3139741X05
I also managed to located and order the flex plate (Nissan calls this a Drive Plate) needed for the 'HD' version (Part Number: 123315S700) for $60 shipped from a salvage yard in south Alabama. (This was difficult to locate as many yards showed it in stock but had sold it with the engine.)
I again can't state how much I appreciate the help of both those directly commenting in this thread, but from all of those who have provided information on the topic of not just transmission swaps in general, but for all of the stuff we need to keep our wonderful old trucks rocking and rolling!
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17 hours ago, onespiritbrain said:
Oh yeah definitely install the input and output shaft seals before you install the transmission. There is also an o-ring on the input shaft that seals inside the torque converter.
I'm looking at the Nissan parts diagrams for the transmission and I'm pretty sure I the o-ring you are talking about, but I'm a bit confused about the seals... The seals I see for the input and output shafts seem to be buried behind a few snap rings and plates. Surely I am looking missing something? If you have the time to track a part number or lookup code on a diagram, I'd be eternally grateful.
If it helps, the truck I got the donor transmission from has the VIN:
1N6MD29YX2C378481
I am gonna go and see if I can scour the factory service manual again for a better exploded parts diagram. If that fails, I'll just have to watch one of the RE4R01A tear down videos to see where any seals come out.
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Alright, good info, thanks guys! I got the truck cleaned up and prepped for surgery today. I hope to get started on pulling parts out a little at a time each day after work. I'll definitely get on swapping those seals/gaskets, changing the 'filter' screen, cleaning the pan, and such.
I appreciate the input!
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Cooling line flushing would be placing the intake line in new fluid at a level lower than the transmission to fight air bubbles, and the discharge line in a waste bucket? I haven't messed with many automatics, so I am just guessing at that. The last time my Pathfinder has it's fluid changed (in 2013 or 2014, right after it began to hang up and not shift from first) I took it to a shop.
Or would I want to fill it through the dipstick as usual, still using the discharge line as the drain?
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Okay, next update, mostly as a log for myself I suppose...
Yesterday I made the 5 hour round trip to fetch my 'new' transmission. It came with the transfer case, which I did not expect. This is where I am baffled... There is an entire thread, from not that long ago, dedicated to information about the supposed HD version of the transmission released with the VG33ER and VQ35DE engine equipped vehicles of certain years. It is said these are the best bolt in replacements, but there is a lot of confusion about identifying them. The factory service manual listed the transmission model codes for the VG33ER specific transmissions, which my new one matched, the VIN of the donor car had an 'M' as the fourth letter, and it has an extra sensor that my current transmission doesn't. Do I have something wrong, or misplaced guesses at what I am supposed to be looking at?
Anyway, my confused babbling over, the transmission came from a Frontier with about 140K miles. The staff were super helpful and friendly (shout out to Turner and Sons Auto Parts in Gillsville, GA), the transmission with transfer case and torque converter was only $300, and they loaded it into the truck bed for me. I didn't even break a sweat, which is saying something for this Georgia heat.
I suppose the next step is to get it cleaned up, drain the fluids and flush the cooler lines, then get it in there. I do need to locate a transmission jack because that assembly is more than my stick self can wrestle.
If anyone has any tips on flushing the transmission, valve body, torque converter, or cooler/lines, feel free to throw some knowledge my way. If any has any questions or wants any specific photos of the transmission before I install it, I am happy to oblige. Until the next update, thanks to you smart folks for all the good info, and for helping my keep my hands dirty!
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Hello!
Sadly the forums here seem to grow slower and slower. Even I took a hiatus for quite a while...
Regardless, yes, there is a lot of good information on here to search through about transmission swaps. I am actually going to pickup a transmission in just a few hours out of a 2002 Xterra to put in my 1994 Pathfinder. If you find my thread on the transmission swap, I plan to update it and add photos with more information as I go.
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While this may not answer any questions on exact accessories to swap, or which years are the easiest to bolt and plug right in, it does have a lot of good information on the VG33E itself.
I've been reading through all of the VG33E swap threads and trying to find out how everyone else goes about it. It seems a lot of people recycle their old accessories which causes the problem with the harmonic balancer needing to be machined. If I find any more good links on straight forward swaps, I'll post them here for you.
Transmission Swap
in 90-95 WD21 Pathfinders
Posted
I have now checked the fluid level... Somehow, even after not adding that much fluid (~7 quarts) it is little high, but installing the pressure tester caused some to drain out. The pressure test shows basically no pressure. I'm going to have to double check this after I figure out if I have the correct sized fitting to screw into the transmission. I am going off eyeball measuring but it doesn't screw it super easy. It doesn't require a ton of force, though, either. I'll have a search around to see what I find out about the official Nissan tool size vs what I am current trying to use. It doesn't leak with the fitting installed or during the test, so I assume it isn't a problem. The gauge could be DOA, but it does move a bit. The reverse port shows less than 10PSI. Hmmm...